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Off Topics > **Century Heli Quality Issue: Potential Hawk Buyers Read This

Kaos2
Senior Heliman
Location: Tennessee

Hey Falcon,

I hate to burst your bubble, but if you think a jury gets ALL the information in this country, you're sadly mistaken. With all the admissible evidence rules and evidence suppression efforts the lawyers do, one thing is absolutely sure, a jury RARELY sees all the information.

I don't think anyone has said they hate Century either. What has been said is that it appears that Century doesn't treat their customers as well as they should. If you've never had to occasion to deal with them, you'd never know. If you have, and they treated you well, then you have a different opinion. The bottom line is that if a swashplete assembled by Century (which is common to every Hawk kit) was assembled incorrectly by the factory, Century is responsible. Now, if you believe that Century can misassemble a part, ship it to a customer and somehow the customer should be left holding the bag, please explain. What other evidence do you need? And, who is Rondey King? Does he fly heli's???

02-13-2004 06:39 PM

rickc
Elite Veteran
Location: Creve Coeur IL. (Peoria Area)

Quote
In the end some of us agree that Corn should have been given his parts.

I agree, Corn purchased at kit with the swash was pre-assembled by a Century representative. Due to the swashplate not being assembled correctly it malfunctioned and caused him a loss. He should be compensated for his loss. When he sent the part in Century preferred to deny his claim and in my opinion basically made the point across to him that he was trying to get something for nothing from them.

I can't see Corn going through all this for a little over 100 dollars in parts, it has to be more the idea to express that Century tends to not be a reputable company when it comes to customer service and he wants to bring this to others attention. This way potential buyers can take all this into consideration before choosing what line of heli to purchase.

Rick

02-13-2004 06:51 PM

HOMEPAGE

corn_tortilla
Heliman
Location: Round Rock

Quote
I can't see Corn going through all this for a little over 100 dollars in parts, it has to be more the idea to express that Century tends to not be a reputable company

Well said, but it is a little of both. It's the principle of the cause of the crash that Century should own up. If I had dumb-thumbed, or didn't do a preflight, OR EVEN THE PART FELL INTO THE WEAR/TEAR Category ,etc then the total cost should fall upon me.

But that wasn't the case here.

~corn

02-13-2004 07:08 PM

the Wasp
rrProfessor
Location: Vt

Ray,,, straight up,,, my problem with you,,, is,,, you go on and on and on, it's like you have a fixation on defacing Century and making us who fly Centry look like we are beneath you, you have it in for Century and Century owners, it's like something you can't get out of your system !!, you have been going on and on like this for quite a few months now !!

and then,,, you call me a child,,, unbelievable man !!

Ray, if I wrote the belittling crap you do, and my wife read it, she sure would be ashamed of me, she would stop and think twice about me, and I sure would understand her !!

straight up Ray,,, my problem with you, is your own fault, it's you that keeps bashing, it's NOT me that needs to talk with you on the phone, it's you "you" that needs to look at yourself !! !!

Jim

Jim
Buzz Buzz Buzz

02-13-2004 07:18 PM

the Wasp
rrProfessor
Location: Vt

Ray,,, as I said, you have been going on and on with your "negative comments" for quite a few months now,,, yes, I do perceive that as bashing !!

Jim

Jim
Buzz Buzz Buzz

02-13-2004 08:42 PM

Andrew_S
Veteran
Location: Gaston, South Carolina

Can't we all just....get along?????

02-13-2004 09:12 PM

Falcon SE
Senior Heliman
Location: College Station, TX

Kaos,

Quote
I hate to burst your bubble, but if you think a jury gets ALL the information in this country, you're sadly mistaken. With all the admissible evidence rules and evidence suppression efforts the lawyers do, one thing is absolutely sure, a jury RARELY sees all the information.

My point exactly, thank you for making it with me. We are being asked to draw the same conclusion based on the information given. I NEVER said anything about who was right or wrong in my example. I used it to illustrate that we are being shown ONLY what we need to see to draw the conclusion that whoever gave us the information wants us to arrive it. Your right, the same holds true in courtrooms as well but that was not my argument.

Wasp,

Name calling is the surest sign of a juvenile mentality so I wouldn’t waste my time on Rstacy if I were you. All that will happen is he will eventually make you stoop to his level. to compete with his mouth.

02-13-2004 09:23 PM

the Wasp
rrProfessor
Location: Vt

word-up Dude...

Jim

Jim
Buzz Buzz Buzz

02-13-2004 09:27 PM

oldfart
Elite Veteran
Location: Vancouver, Canada

On and on and on

What can I say. I checked with Denis at Century and this is their side in a nutshell.

There are two kinds of threaded ball joints, those for the servo wheels with a 2mm threaded end and others with 3mm threaded ends. The 2mm units are black and the 3mm units are silver, Why you may well ask? So that it is easy to tell the difference at a glance.

Those in the swashplate are silver units with 3mm threads. On the assembly line these are the ones in the boxes where the swashplates are assembled. So it is virtually impossible for a black 2mm unit to be in one of these boxes and if per 1/10000000000 chance one did appear in the box.....what? It would be black....immediately begging the person assembling the unit to discard it and use a proper one.

So how could a 2mm unit get mounted on the swashplate ???? A mystery for sure, but I can certainly see Century's reluctance to think it a fault of their assembly line.

As I have sold literally thousands of their kits here in Canada and never ever seen this happen, again I can understand them wondering about it also.

Could they have just said....well, I am sure it is not our error....but for the benefit of customer relations we will offer to do something for this fellow? Possibly but either way, it is their call to make.

Phil

02-14-2004 12:13 AM

Kaos2
Senior Heliman
Location: Tennessee

Your argument is a logic based argument (no evidence). If the part was there, certainly nobody would have built it. I would like to believe that to be true, but sadly, it is not.

In my 25+ years of experience with assembly lines, I can say unequivocally that if the part is there, somebody WILL assemble it eventually, no matter how ridiculous it seems. Also, we recieve mixed stock from suppliers often enough that one must always be on the lookout for the potential of mixed stock. There are numerous examples in many manufacturing areas where wrong stock gets assembled and out to the customer. If that's what Century based its decision on, it appears to be VERY weak.

02-14-2004 12:26 AM

tailwhip
Senior Heliman
Location: Southern WI

I too have worked in assembly lines and agree with kaos2.
People are in a hurry and/or can be distracted when assembling components. Mistakes happen. Also I work in the Auto industry,If say a tie-rod came off...**** would hit the fan. And believe me the manufacturer would stand behind the product...No question. Otherwise they would lose that customer and all his friends and families business.
Nobody wants to lose business to the competition.

02-14-2004 02:11 AM

corn_tortilla
Heliman
Location: Round Rock

OldFart,

Quote

Some of the questions I received from Century were:
Q: Why didn't you check this part before flight
A: I did, it was tight and appeared to hold fine.

Q: Did you notice that the ball links were different colors.
A: I thought it was to indicate which portion was for the For/Aft cyclic

Q: Did you notice a black-ball on the instruction manual.
A: No, I didn't.
Q: Why didn't you check up on that.
A: I didn't dis-assemble it because the instructions didn't tell me to & (Some Assemblies May Come Pre-Assembled was on the cover page/2nd page of the manual) I assumed the swashplate was one of those assemblies

If I had known that Century had sh!tty QC then I would have questioned the difference. But considering all the (*positive*) aurora towards the *'new century'* I did not think it was necessary.

Perhaps if Century spent the money to put the legal disclaimers up to spec for their instruction manual (IE. Check our sh!t because we might f@ck it up) this would never have happened.

My outtake is this about century (Just my oppinion). Our manuals aren't up to date, our QC isn't at 100% accurany, but we are cheaper than our competition & we don't really give a sh!t about our customer.......... Hell, if I wanted to gamble I'd goto Vegas, lose a $sh!tload$ of cash. At least I'd know in advance and get a free steak dinner and get drunk for free.

But I didn't get a bottle of Sack, nor a set of Omaha steaks just a card that says thanks for playing the game. Please try again I think that the average user would rather take the sure thing, than gamble on HW when dealing with recreational cashflow.

~corn
PS. Again, waiting on an OFFICIAL public response from Century. Did ya'll forget your login names and passwords?

02-14-2004 03:21 AM

rickc
Elite Veteran
Location: Creve Coeur IL. (Peoria Area)

I just can't see why Century thinks Corn would disassemble a swashplate and thenput it back together while building the kit. I just built a second Raptor 50 for and the Swash came pre-assembled in a bag of its own. I never had an urge to take it apart. I'm surprised so many think it's Corns fault, You really think the quality of assemblers Century hires are not capable of making mistakes? Were not talking UAW here.

Rick

02-14-2004 03:28 AM

HOMEPAGE

carpetjohn3
Heliman
Location: Glendora CA.

What is this Corn

THE NEVER ENDING STORY

Think you should have put this whole thing to Century before you put it on this site

Get a life and get off of it.

Have a nice day.

Have a nice day John

02-14-2004 03:50 AM

rickc
Elite Veteran
Location: Creve Coeur IL. (Peoria Area)

Quote
Get a life and get off of it.

LoL... Hummingbird pilot with 4 post, better site back and enjoy the ride for while before you bang the keys. You might learn something.

Rick

02-14-2004 04:36 AM

HOMEPAGE

the Wasp
rrProfessor
Location: Vt

the bottom line is here !!

I just checked,,,

I took a 2mm threaded ball, and put it in a 3mm threaded hole "on a Century swash", in my conclusion there is NO way "NO way at all" Corn could have removed a 3mm threaded ball and replaced it with a 2mm threaded ball "and expect it to stay", the 2mm ball would just slide in and never "never" tighten, as soon as he let-go of the 2mm threaded ball it would have fell out,,,

(the ONLY way a 2mm ball would stay in that 3mm threaded hole is if "if" the 2mm ball was glued in !!)

the next question should be, "what size hole does Century drill in these swash for the 3mm ball ?!!" I would expect it to be slightly smaller than 3mm, again, if Century did drill a hole slightly smaller than 3mm a 2mm threaded ball would NOT have tighten, it WOULD have fell out !!

and another thing, I just micked a brand new unused Century 2mm threaded black ball, it's threads are .076 (considering that 2mm is .079 thousand's),,, the 3mm threaded silver ball was .115 thousand's,,, (that's a diff of .039, which is 1mm)

in my conclusion,,,
there is NO way Corn removed the silver 3mm ball and replaced it with a 2mm black ball, "unless he glued the 2mm ball in, which I don't believe he did" he would have known that was unsafe,,,

same thing for century, there is NO way Century could have drilled a hole for a 3mm silver ball and mounted a black 2mm ball, because the 2mm would have fell out, unless Century glued the 2mm ball in,,,

on the other hand I know a little about tapping and threading, for a 3mm threaded ball a hole larger than 2mm would be needed, so again if Century did put a 2mm threaded ball in a hole driled for a 3mm therad ball, the 2mm ball would ONLY stay in if "IF" it was glued !!

what happend ??,,, I sure as hell don't know !!

Jim

Jim
Buzz Buzz Buzz

02-14-2004 05:37 AM

Lift
Elite Veteran
Location: Houston, TX

Quote
Your argument is a logic based argument (no evidence). If the part was there, certainly nobody would have built it. I would like to believe that to be true, but sadly, it is not.

Let me say that the part wasn't there at the factory nor was it on the swashplate when Mr. Tortilla's assembled his kit. My thought is that the swashplate was missing a ball. Mr. Tortilla used a ball from one of the bags(which is meant for the tail rotor pushrod) and screwed it in. Then, when he had a crash he blamed it on Century.

If it was there the assemblier would have had to go get a 5.5mm nut driver to put it on. Nevermind the fact that all the silver balls on the previous 50 swashplate that they had been working on the rest of the morning required a hex driver. Don't you think they would have noticed that? Seeing how this has NEVER been reported before proves it's unlikeliness.

I'm so sick of this thread it's making me sick. It's the same 4 or 5 guys that keep posting on it to keep it going. Your motives are certain.....

Since it's Corn's word versus Century and you 4 or 5 guys have ASS-U-MEd that he is telling the truth and sided with him I'm going to side with Century.

Would it have been easier to give the guy a $160 dollar kit? Sure. But how many Cornholes are you going to put up with if your Century?

I've seen Century come in here and take care of MANY guys that have had machine failures. Go ask them if Century stands behind their product. They do! I just think they decided this story was toooooo fishy to believe.

02-14-2004 05:41 AM

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