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Got Jet Fuel? Turbine Helicopters > HP5 Bell230 finally flying !!
 
 
heliVoYVeteran - Location: NJ -
Looks like my HP5 powered Vario Bell230 will be flight ready be weekend's end. I just have plumbing, and electronic hookup left to do .. Making and fitting the pipe was the hardest part ....http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t59445p1/
I ended up having to put steel rods through the pipe to help it maintain an oval shape coming out the top. For fuel tanks, i decided not to lay up kevlar ones yet, but instead am using 4 24oz dubro tanks and a UAT header (over 100 oz of fuel) .. this should be enough fuel for around 13 - 14 min of flight ..So far, it looks like the helicopter will be weighing in somewhere around 24lbs dry ... (with 100oz fuel wet, it will be quite heavy !! ) i will have to redo the pitch curve from what i had on the Jetcopter with this HP5 (aiming for -5/+14) ...



the tail was an awesome coincidence of a lignup. Im actually running the boom all the way through the tail, so this takes any structual responsibility away from the fiberglass tail. The mount for the boom is right off of my Jetcopter, and the boom is the exact zize, i did not even have to cut or adjust anything. The boom is supported in the rear with expansion goam (home depot)



heres an idea of the tank layout ...


top view of components .. notice how the rear of the mechanics are braced to the sides of the fuselage, and how the pipe in turn is bloted to the brace ...


another view of the tanks .. notice the tray i set up for the rear fueltank .. also you can see the retract servo .. this one has over 100oz of torque, and does not stall on the rather stiff and tight gear mechanism ...


here is a rear shot of the heli temporarily rigged up with all doors and cowling ... i am very happy with how the pipe exhausts came out ....


this is next on the work bench ... i have to say im looking forward to an easy build on this one .. no custom anything, mechanicss will fit right in as per menufacturer design, and i aleady have the pipe from Graupner (actually made by JetCat) as I do not think i would have the patience to make another split pipe at this time ... (for the record, i bought the SB-90 from a source diferent than V-East, It is cheaper and faster to just order from overseas such as Germany or the UK)



I also have this EC-135 waiting to get started on, but it will have to wait for some other projects first, this one will be scaled out big time and will take a while to make ...



come on guys !!! post some pict of your projects !!! lets get this forum rolling !!


Wojtek
09-20-2003 Over year old.
 
 
heliVoYVeteran - Location: NJ -
ready to go !

Now the 230 is 100% flight ready !!!

weight: 22.5 lbs dry
fuel capacity:115oz
power: 2 1800mah batteries 1 for RX, and 1 for 4 CCPM servos (split by ED power bus)
mechanics: HP5 with 1400rpm speed up gear

can't wait to fly !!



I will post a video of it flying when i get the chance. When i had the turbine in a Jetcopter SX (pod/boom setup) the heli weighed in at around 19lbs, and i was able to loop, roll, split s, and do multiple pirouetes .. I wont be doing much aerobatics with this 230 now, but I'm hoping for some nice split Ses, pirouetes, beyond that the 10mm main shaft might be too stressed (at around 30lbs of a heli when wet .. )

























Wojtek
09-22-2003 Over year old.
 
 
optikaman
Veteran
Location: EnglishTown N.J.

Flying Video

OK, OK well where is the friggin video....
enough with the photos we want to see it flying!!!


Alan
09-22-2003 Over year old.
 
 
dperry
Senior Heliman
Location: Oklahoma City, OK

Let us know how it goes

Joseph is still telling me my 230 will be ready next week.

Any way can't wait to get mine!

Don
09-22-2003 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
heliVoY
Veteran
Location: NJ

Quote 
Flying Video OK, OK well where is the friggin video....enough with the photos we want to see it flying!!!
\

Optikamn, !!!
you PRICK ( i dont think the word DICK is allowed here) !!!! he he he If you had not smashed up my blades, we all would have been enjoying the flight videos TODAY ! (including transmited on board videos ! ) you had to show off autorotating your Jetcopter ? didn't you ?
but oh no, I HAVE NO BLADES !!!




Wojtek
09-22-2003 Over year old.
 
 
heliVoY
Veteran
Location: NJ

Quote 
Joseph is still telling me my 230 will be ready next week.


Don, You better hold him to it ! I hear "next wee: for over 1/2 a year !!! , and he still has not gotten everything back to me !! Don't let JoJo stall you for too long ..

I do have to say, im sure you will be very pleased with it onec you get it ...




Wojtek
09-22-2003 Over year old.
 
 
BigD
Senior Heliman
Location: Dallas, GA

Hey man, don't forget to strap hot dogs to the blades. With the exhaust blowing straight up like that they will be done in no time
09-22-2003 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
optikaman
Veteran
Location: EnglishTown N.J.

Slightly used blades for sale

I have a slightly used set of 805mm 14, 75mm vario blades for sale

These blades are in almost perfect condition, well they where at one time

i can cut my gray blades and you can use them for testing, they should generate a little more lift then the white ones.


Alan A.k.A. the D.I._.K.
09-23-2003 Over year old.
 
 
heliVoY
Veteran
Location: NJ

though other helis (like the ec-135 or the nh90) do shoot the exhaust into the blades like the 230 i set up , the rotor disk is higher by 2 - 3 inchesaway from the exhaust , and i guess this seems to make all the diference ... I ran the 230 up, and after about 1 min of hovering i landed it for inspection. The HP5 ran just fine, and the GSU showed a "Max R average temp " of only 511 celcius , with a maximum temperature of 590c on startup only ... however, 2 min 30 sec of total run time was enough to melt the foam inside the blades, and actually the fiberglass on the blades bubbled ... 1 more minute and i would have been throwing a blade ! .. so what am i doing ? ... well, i welded deflectors onto the exhausts after shortening the exhaust stacks by about 1", and I will also add another 1" of height to the rotor disk by us of a longer main shaft ...

As for the hover, the heli felt diferent in the hover also, because of the exhaust going into the rotor disk, it feels like its constantly in an exagerated form of ground efect (i have had people tell me this, and its just something to get used to .. )

Well, i hope to fly again soon.. Unfortunately on my last run up, my HP5 decided to suck up and eat the FOD screen (fortunately Jetcat uses a plastic neting here) and that gunked up my intake , and also made the turbine run hotter .... nice sparcs out the back also from the screen being eaten up ... turbine is already off to JetCat for a check up ... I have 2 other HP5s also, so I might just use one of them for now to do more testing with the pipe ......


well, here are some pics at the field, and a video hey at least i got to cycle the gear !!!



VIDEO 1

pic 1

pic 1

pic 1


Optikaman: thanx for the vids and photos !




Wojtek
09-26-2003 Over year old.
 
 
h20pilot1
Heliman
Location: S.E Michigan USA

Very Cool!

To follow the building to flight!

Great Job!

Al
09-26-2003 Over year old.
 
 
Rico
Senior Heliman
Location: New-Caledonia(South Pacific)

Great Job Wojtek very interesting post , and thanks to share !
From my experience with the Big Carbon Airwolf , I will suggest you to mod the rear landing gear or you will have an issue with it ,soon or later with those white plastic parts that hold the wheels , yes they are not holding the weight in the time and will break after bending , I have replaced them with custom made aluminium , not hard to do and will avoid a possible crash due to those breaking on a heavier landing
Thanks again and keep us posted on the next flight .
Eric
09-27-2003 Over year old.
 
 
midwestpilot
Elite Veteran
Location: Crystal Lake, IL

Do you calculate exhaust volume...

when making pipes do you (did you) calculate exhaust volume...
is the diameter of each port 1/2 of the original?

Do you need to allow for more volume with longer runs?

Do ya do ya do ya?

Reason I ask is the exhaust seems large...I know you have an insulating layer that adds to the size(on that layer...can it be closer or is that driven by some formula as well)

So many questions, so little time

In life there is no spacebar!

Rich Erikson AMA 6175
09-30-2003 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
heliVoY
Veteran
Location: NJ

midwestpilot,

the area of the 2 exhaust ports has to be the same or more than that of the rear exhaust of the turbine. This does not mean just slitting the diameter in 2 ... you have to figure out the crossectional area based on the diameter, slit the area in 2 and then reverse the formula to give you the diameter of the 2 separate exhaust ports ...

The reason for this is that you want the exhaust flowing as freely as possible, because the harder for the exhaust to get out, the hotter the turbine will run ..

in my case, i did not follow the formula exactly, each exhaust port has the same circumferance of the reat of the turbine, meaning I have almost double the crossectional exhaust area coming out of the top of the fuse as is coming out the back of the turbine (tot exactly 2 times as much because the exhaust stacks are oval, and not round, which afects the area ....

the reason i increased the area for the exhaust is to make up somewhat for the sharp angle i have on the pipe coming up off of the turbine, which is already causing additional heat as well ....


I am actually rebuilding the pipe right now (i cut the top 5" off each stack) , and will have the exhaust coming out sideways ... this should help me stop the blades from getting toasted ... (1" longer main shaft will also help ... )


hope this is the info you were looking for ...



brg,

Wojtek
09-30-2003 Over year old.
 
 
midwestpilot
Elite Veteran
Location: Crystal Lake, IL

next question...

but you have already hinted to the answer...bends in exhaust are bad?

I was thinking if you made sort of a Z pipe to get the exhaust to point more backward and up..ala airwolf...if you follow

It sounds as if you are going to port the exhause out the side of the heli...that would be a shame...but if there is no other way.

Just had another thought...if you are going to deviate from scale exhaust...could you move the ports farther back, near the screens you have installed, which would allow for sleek and possibly cool looking exhaust.....

Just thoughts from a mad man

In life there is no spacebar!

Rich Erikson AMA 6175
10-01-2003 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
midwestpilotElite Veteran - Location: Crystal Lake, IL -
kindo like this

Not such a good photoshop job...but you get the idea


but using more of this kind of idea on the pipe itself...just bent upward and reduce angle of exhaust to rearward and upward...45 degrees or something.



In life there is no spacebar!

Rich Erikson AMA 6175
10-01-2003 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
heliVoY
Veteran
Location: NJ

midwestpilot,

I hear what you are saying, but its tight in there ... getting the pipe all the way out back would require more changes than I feel like dealing with this time , actually thats how the thing was supposed to be set up originally (but i wont ho into that because i promised to go easy on the vendors and dealers for a while .... long story ... pm me if you want to know ... ... My tail servo is also back there and would get cooked with the pipe out that far also .. ...

What i am doing is cutting off the top 3" off the pipe ends, and diverting it sideways at around a 35 degree anngle (from horizontal) This is ok by me as this is to be strictly a high performance sport scale helicopter, that all i care is if it looks cool ...

My EC135 is what i will be scaling the hell out of .. and the NH90 will be not scale whatsoever, im going to butcher that helicopter into somehting more fun ...


with the 1400 head speen, and only 3 - 4.5 lbs heavier than my jetcopter setup, i hope to do more than just scale forward flight with this one ...

regards,

Wojtek
10-04-2003 Over year old.
 
 
midwestpilot
Elite Veteran
Location: Crystal Lake, IL

Keep us in the loop...

Post pics....ya know the 1000 word thingy...

In life there is no spacebar!

Rich Erikson AMA 6175
10-06-2003 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
heliVoYVeteran - Location: NJ -
Well, i got a chance to get back to this project, and finally i think i have a solution to the blade heating problems ...

I started out by trying to install simple diverters for the exhaust in the exhaust stacks .... this kept the blades cooler (tested on Optikaman's old woodie blades he had) but not as cool as id like. Also, the turbine ran hotter than usual by 150c and i had some temp issues inside the fuselage, however durring this test flight, the HP5 also managed sucking up and digesting the plastic FOD screen, which in itself cauld have caused the overtemp ...

here is a pic of the diverters ...




this is what i did to the pipe last night .. i will just send the exhaust out the sides, and I have a new cowling on order from VarioUSA . I am also going to possibly raise the rotor disk by 1" higher ... I think this will finally work with a good blade temp ..






note: these pipe ends are not finished yet in these pictures, i still have to trim them to the outer shape of the cowling ...




Wojtek
10-10-2003 Over year old.
 
 
aashu
Veteran
Location: Garden State , NJ

AMAZING

What a beautiful bird !

Wojtek I mailed you in the past .. I live in Edison , NJ and was wondering someday I could bring over my Gasser and Bell 212 fuse and you could give me some tips . This is my first scale . Though there are lots of helpful people here , I want someone who could have a look at the stuff and give me some directions going forward.

Thanks

Proudly Flying in NJ, USA
10-15-2003 Over year old.
 
 
heliVoY
Veteran
Location: NJ

hey aashu,

ill keep in touch, i should have the bell230 back and flight readin in a week or so .. ill let you know when I will be taking it up, definately join us..


brg,

Wojtek
10-17-2003 Over year old.
 
 
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