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Main Discussion > Hyper 50 Temps--- Check after Auto OR Powered Landing??

Eleven_Bravo
Senior Heliman
Location: Modesto,CA

This shoud be funny then.

Rich is more of a deeper sound that sounds like a brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Properly tuned sounds higher pitched like neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee they also make this sound when they are too lean I think jschenck said it best too lean is a cackling sound

A metallic rattle = toasted bearing if you want to know what this sounds like next time you change a bearing break the balls and retainers out of it and shake the inside and outside race loosely in your hand. I keep the races of an old hyper bearing in my box to show people the sound. If in doubt change it out. Bearings are cheap. If you run a bad bearing tooo long a piece of the balls will break off and go through your engine totaling it on its way out. Bearing 20 bux. Due to my hearing loss I couldn't hear the sound of my bearing crapping out it cost me roughly 105 bux.

If you wait tooo long
Piston 25
Ring 20
Sleeve40
Head if a big enough piece tears it up too bad 65
Bearing 20

In my case I chose not to replace my head but next time around I will notice that sound and not take chances and keep the 80 dollar difference in my pocket. These figures are not exact just rounded ones.

Its not a maneuver until your looking down on it. ~Jason Krause~ Phoenix FF 08

07-17-2008 04:18 AM

ppridday
Veteran
Location: Canadian in Detroit Lakes MN / Guarapari Brazil

Any chance you could make a YouTube video of yourself making those sounds?

Paul

"There's someone in my head, but it's not me..."

07-17-2008 04:35 AM

jschenck
Elite Veteran
Location: La Vista, NE.

fyi - I just bought several sets of replacement OS-50 bearings for $7/set + shipping so it's worth replacing even if you're not sure the bearings are bad. Before they start rattling they make sort of a washing sound, like a noisy power steering pump from an old Ford truck. If you can catch it early you'll avoid the expensive engine damage from bearing shrapnel, as pointed out previously in this thread.

...yep...

07-17-2008 04:41 AM

artimus
Veteran
Location: Puyallup WA

A rich motor willl make a sound like a four stroke engine....more like "bub bub bub bub" and a lean engine make a "Na na na na na na"
Ive seen Eleven Bravo make those sounds...but you got to get him drunk.

AMA #890376..... Flying Helis is like sex ...you dont have to be good at it to enjoy it....

07-17-2008 05:14 AM

jschenck
Elite Veteran
Location: La Vista, NE.

I have found a good way to test for a lean mid-range (tune with a combo of low end and high end needles) is to go into a hover about 2' off the ground and hit the throttle hold. It should immediately go to idle and coast down to the ground. If it comes off the rpm slowly, richen the bottom end and open the top end a couple of clicks. Good test after flying around for a few minutes.

...yep...

07-17-2008 02:17 PM

flustercluck
Senior Heliman
Location: newnan ga usa

ok we need to post audio (.wav) files for who can best approximate engines sounds

that's the other thing... I've been messing around with both the high/low needles.. to get the burble out during spoolup I leaned the low needle like maybe 5 minutes on an hour clock face... that seemed to help

07-17-2008 02:53 PM

jschenck
Elite Veteran
Location: La Vista, NE.

yep, spoolup should be smooth. If it's not you may be rich on the bottom end. Test for lean with the throttle hold to make sure it's rich and not lean. Again I think the back plate temp in this situation helps get you close.

...yep...

07-17-2008 02:59 PM

Eleven_Bravo
Senior Heliman
Location: Modesto,CA

Remember to be careful with your low needle so that you do not break it.

Its total adjustment range on your low needle on a hyper 50 if from 9 to 3 o'clock it comes set to 12 from OS. Or 90 deg each way from factory center. It takes very small adjustments that rich blubbery spool up and idle should be gone by 1 o'clock. Very small adjustments because you should fly it after an adjustment it will make your idle up hover lean, if you go to far you will experience the previously mentioned cackling sound.

Its not a maneuver until your looking down on it. ~Jason Krause~ Phoenix FF 08

07-18-2008 01:22 AM

flustercluck
Senior Heliman
Location: newnan ga usa

Hey 11B, that's VERY good info. Thanks. I did not know this. In fact after I read your reply I decided to check. Here's what I found (assume the needle is a clock face):

Turning the low needle VERY gently, the range was about 10 o'clock CCW, and about 4 o'clock CW. The setting I've flown at for quite a while is just shy of 3 o'clock.

When I got the motor (can't remember now if it was new or used), the low needle was about 1:30-ish. I had a decent idle, but would get the burbles during spoolup. So little by little I leaned it til I got a smooth spool. As I did, I could hear the idle speed increase (slightly).

You have me wondering now whether I've leaned the LN too much.

I also checked the HN: I'm at almost exactly 1-1/4 turns out from closed.

I run an Enya 3, and CP15%, on a stock TT muffler.

Advice from the experts, please: am I where I need to be??

07-18-2008 01:47 AM

Eleven_Bravo
Senior Heliman
Location: Modesto,CA

IF it dies when going to the line it can be both rich or lean if you are at either extreme. Don't go straight to your low needle if you start to experience inconsistent idle. If your hyper all the sudden does not want to idle properly the first place I would go is the rear bearing I know that sounds strange but thats what mine started to do when the bearing started to go. If you know without a shadow of doubt your engine bearings are good then you can go to your low needle with tiny tiny adjustments. If your not seeing changes with half hour adjustments something else is wrong.

Its obvious if you are rich you have already said that it blubbers and the spool up is not smooth.

If you are lean when you land it will want to hang on the rpm instead of coming back down to idle. Another example is what jschenck said you flip into TH and its hanging on rpm instead of going immediately to your TH's set value.

Another thing you could do that would drastically improve the ease of tuning is change out that TT pipe for a CY MP 2 or 5. When I put my first MP on a heli I had to go 6 clicks leaner just to get it to run it was so rich just from the change of the pipe it was dripping fuel from the exhaust. The only thing I can figue is that the pipe was that much less restrictive temp dropped from 190 to 140 and I did notice more power and much more predictable easier tuning. When I put them on my 30's a 37 and a 32 that I do not have anymore, the MP did the same for them. Im not saying they are the greatest pipe in the world I know better pipes exist. I can say this they sure have worked great for me I have never regretted spending any $$ on CY MPs.

Its not a maneuver until your looking down on it. ~Jason Krause~ Phoenix FF 08

07-18-2008 03:37 AM

flustercluck
Senior Heliman
Location: newnan ga usa

11B, more good stuff- thx

hard to believe a pipe can make that much difference??? get what ya pay for, I guess

I'll scout around and see what I can find

07-19-2008 04:19 PM

flustercluck
Senior Heliman
Location: newnan ga usa

MP2 or 5... what's the difference?

noise not an issue where I fly

07-19-2008 04:20 PM

Eleven_Bravo
Senior Heliman
Location: Modesto,CA

The MP2 is an older version the MP5 is the newest version of the MP. Well CY has the stick banger edition of the MP out now I guess thats the newest.

Some like the MP2 better than the MP5. Thats why I mentioned it in case you run across a used one I do not think CY makes the MP2 anymore. I really cannot give a fair comparison of MP2 vs MP5. I had MP2s on my OS 32 and 37 the MP5 I am flying now is on my 50. There is really no comparing 30s and 50s definately when it comes to pipe gains. My HS needle on my Hyper is roughly 1 1/4 turns open from full closed. I could probaly go about 4 more clicks in but perfer to stay a hair on the rich side for a bit longer motor life.

Just because it happened to me don't automatically think you can go 6 clicks leaner just because you get one of these pipes please check your tune with a temp gun before you start leaning needles. This is just a friendly reminder and to keep others reading this thread in check I don't want anybody pissed at me wanting to beat me with a sock that has their dead engine inside

Its not a maneuver until your looking down on it. ~Jason Krause~ Phoenix FF 08

07-19-2008 04:43 PM

flustercluck
Senior Heliman
Location: newnan ga usa

Actually, we're the same, then: I'm at almost exactly 1.25 turns out from closed on the HN. You are too...

But I run 15%... I assume you do too?

07-19-2008 06:27 PM

Eleven_Bravo
Senior Heliman
Location: Modesto,CA

I run cool power 30%. We may be the same 1.25 open but I bet your hotter than me with the pipe your running.

Its not a maneuver until your looking down on it. ~Jason Krause~ Phoenix FF 08

07-20-2008 01:05 AM

Yug
rrProfessor
Location: UK. Herts

Needle settings vary enormously because the air density (and consequently charge) can vary as much as 30% with temperature and height above sea level as well as general weather conditions. This combined with your nitro content will dramatically effect your needle positions, anywhere between 1 and 2 turns. The low needle however is usually somewhere between 12 and 2 oclock using the standard pinch test.

Vegetable rights and Peace

07-20-2008 01:27 AM

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