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XHELI.COM . Autography FlightPower . Advantage Hobby

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Align T-REX 600N 700N > T-REX 700N The Align engine is released
 
 
Ghostrider
Key Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA

No offense louk05 but your information is inaccurate. If you talk to people that were part of the development, engineering, and testing of this motor you would quickly become aware of the fact that the black head is superior to the blue head.

Sam Gammo
There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness".
08-20-2008 01:40 PM
 
 
creightoncarr
Veteran
Location: Missouri City, Texas - USA

Yep. The side-by-side fin design is more efficient at dissipating heat than the stacked fin design.
08-20-2008 01:43 PM
 
 
epc2
Senior Heliman
Location: Miami , Fl./S.Domingo.

I got a blue one cuz that was the one available at the moment but I know a reputable Align pilot that has tried both of them and actually the black cools a little better , I like the black one better myself but both will do the job for most of us w/o any issues.

epc2.

Team My Wallet.
08-20-2008 02:57 PM
 
 
TooLy
Senior Heliman
Location: Israel

I have just ordered the new Align 91H (black head) and I plan to use my viper head.
James from O.M.I just told me I should use 0.016 inch/0.4mm shims with 30% nitro and two O.S 8 plugs.
I will start with 0.3mm like I did in my SZ engine.

~Roei~
08-20-2008 06:35 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
louk05
Key Veteran
Location: Flying in BelAir Maryland

Nope

If you look at all the stuff said by Align and O.S it is simply due to the fact for it to fit in any model. That is it. The more surface area you have the better cooling you will have. Its very simple. there is no way the head being that close and that small can cool better than the blue one. Its the same head as on the SR and on older TT engines. And at the time every one was saying th blue head on the O.S cooled better. But now O.S has put the same old desighn head on but painted it black its all of a sudden a better cooling head. Not really. If you go on O.S web site you will see that even they them selves say no its not a better cooling head its just the fact that FC3 pilots asked if they could make a smaller head to put on it so they would not have to modify there helis for it to fit. I even called them my self to find out for sure and was told the same thing. You guys are going off assumption here and not facts. Just because they put a black small head on it dose not mean its to help for cooling. Its just for no mod on heli installation. If you guys want feel free to call and ask yourself you will find out that I am wright. I wanted to make sure of this my self as I was also wondering why Align only came out with the blue head. Its simple. Old O.S owners like the blue head and it fits in the T-rex700 with no problems. That is why Align has it out and O.S dose not and to try to keep teh 2 companies apart. But we all know they are both O.S motors. So sorry you guys it dose not cool better.

Fly Hard,Crash Hard,Upgrade, Align,AMA#906056
08-20-2008 10:32 PM
 
 
louk05
Key Veteran
Location: Flying in BelAir Maryland

OH

And yes I am putting the Viper head on as well. That is why the viper head is a low pro head as well. Just to accommodate the shroud with no mod. and I am going to put my pump off my sz-h o nit as well and Omi regulator as well then she should really scream

Fly Hard,Crash Hard,Upgrade, Align,AMA#906056
08-20-2008 10:34 PM
 
 
Ghostrider
Key Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA

louk,

Why don't you call James O'neil and ask him about the testing they did instead of taking what you read for granted. That is of course if you want the real facts.

And if you think the Viper head was only designed simply to fit into a fan shroud, I want some of whatever it is that you are smoking!

Sam Gammo
There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness".
08-20-2008 10:47 PM
 
 
creightoncarr
Veteran
Location: Missouri City, Texas - USA

They could add 20 more rings to the blue head and it wouldn't cool much better. Yes, generally the more surface area available for heat dissipation the better. But that extra surface area does very little good when it's not actually in contact with the heat source. Those outer rings on the blue head are not nearly as effective as the inner rings, or as each fin on the finned (black) head.

I don't see anywhere on the O.S. page where O.S. says the head doesn't cool better. Anyone else?

http://www.os-engines.co.jp/english...1hz_e/index.htm
08-20-2008 11:47 PM
 
 
yoshgixxer
Veteran
Location: york PA usa

we could probably beat this issue black and blue (hehe)...point is the engine seems to be a great powerful engine, with either black or blue head...im sure the blue head is affective enough to keep the engine from melting into a paper weight! i mean there probably a million o.s. engines out there with the same blue head...and i never really read to much about serious over heating issues with proper tuning...so just buy a better cooling fan if you think its to hot!!!

dude..wheres my heli?????ama#902014
08-21-2008 12:58 AM
 
 
jpla010
Senior Heliman
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

I would be very surprised if they did dissipate equal amounts of thermal energy but would not expect an enormous difference the two. Its also a balancing act with the fan as well. One head would probably work better with one fan system then another

Remember those people having problems with the 3DX fan cooling their engine so much it could not get up to an effective operating temperature? You would really have to try both heads in your 700 with a set fan and then tell us which performs better. If it was me flying I doubt Id notice a difference tho..

Jonathon
08-21-2008 03:21 AM
 
 
louk05
Key Veteran
Location: Flying in BelAir Maryland

And i did call. and i was talking about the low pro head is to fit all modkes. not the full desighn. read the full post. Its just not true. I will have to look to see where i saw it and post it. but if you would have read what i said before you would see i dis call and found out that no it dose not cool any better. its jusf to fit all modles with out modding. fc3 pilots were the ones who cam up with all this and asked o.s to make a head to fit all modles without any mods. now why do you think o.s first made the big blue head?? to cool better. when every one else was useing the small head. the more fins the cooler its going to be. the part that touches the head has just as much serface as the black one but it has more fins so its cooler on the out side and continues downward. now iam not saying it cools better. but if you are going of asumption than why cant i?? because you reade it some where on here and another guy on here say he thinks it cools better so you are right? i dont think so. call o.s and find out for your self. i have and they said both head cool the same and it was desighned simply to fit all modles with no modification. I will find it and post it. I read it off a japan post on the motor before it even came out and called to confirm my self. And if you are so right than please show me proff where iam wrong. I know for a fact the desigh feature. think about it. it makes perfect sence.

Fly Hard,Crash Hard,Upgrade, Align,AMA#906056
08-21-2008 03:59 AM
 
 
louk05
Key Veteran
Location: Flying in BelAir Maryland

Oh and the blue head on the hp is tottaly different than the one on yhe szh. it is a new desigh head. it looks nothing like the szh head. i will taje some pics to show to compare. but iam on my phone right now so will work on showing you the post on the 2 heads. iam not at all convincec tbe black is better in any way at all. its simply to fit all modle helis with no mod. that simple. just because a few guys on here say the black cools better dose not mean its facts. I will post it. and do some home work to show me iam wrong. lets compare facts not something some one said.

Fly Hard,Crash Hard,Upgrade, Align,AMA#906056
08-21-2008 04:09 AM
 
 
louk05
Key Veteran
Location: Flying in BelAir Maryland

Ok i found the post again. and it says that the new desighn head was to fit any modle without modding it so that fresh cool clean air coukd get to it. and the desigh of the new head heat sink and back plate heat sink combined help for cooler air and smoother power. So its saying we are both right. but I still dont say it cools better than the new blue head dose on the 700 because its a direct drop in. so depsnding on what heli you have is what motor you want to go with. this is also what i was told when i called. so we are both right. if you have a heli that the blue head will not fit go with the black one. if so then blue one. and do not remove the back plate heat sink.

Fly Hard,Crash Hard,Upgrade, Align,AMA#906056
08-21-2008 04:23 AM
 
 
Ghostrider
Key Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA

I am not going to argue with you anymore but to me, it looks like a minor modification of the old design....which by the way sucks! In fact, it looks like they carved out, or removed, some of the fin surface. I assume this was to give it better cooling. You say less is bad, why did they remove material from the sides if less is bad?

And just one more thing, Mr. James O'Neil is regarded as one of the premier heli engine guru's of this industry. In fact, Mr. O'Neil played a large part of the development of this new engine. Not to mention ALL THE TESTING HE AND HIS PEOPLE DID. That's why for once, OS seems to have manufactured an engine that is as smooth as the YS yet out performs it. I think they finaly got it right.

It is also "my understanding" (I could be wrong) that OS will not even offer the option of the blue head.

Now having said all the stuff I have said in this thread, I don't think the average pilot will notice a huge difference between the two and I would not think twice about running the blue head if it was my only choice or if I already spent money on it. If you do have a problem or wan't more cooling, buy the Viper head. The best of all three heads in my opinion.

Bottom line louk05, do what you want to do. Don't let me influence you in any way. These posts are only my findings and opinions from my own personal research.

Take care,

I'm out!







I will take the vertical fins over the horizontal fins any day of the week. I think it would allow heat disbursement to be much more efficient. Just makes more sense to me.





Sam Gammo
There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness".
08-21-2008 04:52 AM
 
 
louk05
Key Veteran
Location: Flying in BelAir Maryland

No O.S dose and will not offer a blue head. only align dose as it fits the 700 fine. And yes iam going with the viper head as soon as i find one in stock for this motor. and the reglator as well. ys will have nothing on this motor. even stock i dont think ys can compare. So like i said we were both right. the bead in combination with the back plate sink makes for great cooling. and even if the black head did some how cool better i can only see 2-8 deg max. but iam going viper on this thing all the way. i have the blue head one and right now having troubles with getting it tuned right. but ill get it. any ways where can i find a viperhead instock??? every where i have looked they r sold out?

Fly Hard,Crash Hard,Upgrade, Align,AMA#906056
08-21-2008 05:26 AM
 
 
TooLy
Senior Heliman
Location: Israel

You can order directly from James, that's what I did.

~Roei~
08-21-2008 07:29 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
louk05
Key Veteran
Location: Flying in BelAir Maryland

For the viper head?? link pls and how about the regulator as iam going to put the pump on mine just to see how she dose. i know my szh idled like a kitten purring and i cant get my hp to run for crap. i tried the 2 shim from my szh and still running like crap. i tried running her lean and had to do one of my best autos ever at about 100-150 feet. iam running coolpower 30 and hatori sb18 pipe. my szh ran great and smooth as can be. but this one i cant get to run good to save my life. neddles are both at 1.5 out from closed and that is working for everyone else. so any help would really be nice. Thanks a lot.

Fly Hard,Crash Hard,Upgrade, Align,AMA#906056
08-21-2008 07:42 AM
 
 
red_z06
Elite Veteran
Location: Dumont, NJ

New Hatori (not SB18) for OS 91HZ and Align 91H should be arriving in US momentarily.

www.justinchi.com
08-21-2008 01:02 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Ghostrider
Key Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA

Quote 
New Hatori (not SB18) for OS 91HZ and Align 91H should be arriving in US momentarily.

Really? That is awesome! Usually Hatori takes a few months to get one out. How do you know this Red? I have not heard anything about it or seen any pics.

I do know the Align 90 pipe was just released but I would much rather have the Hatori.

I am also curious if they changed the header to be more like the Kasama header.

Sam Gammo
There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness".
08-21-2008 03:09 PM
 
 
red_z06
Elite Veteran
Location: Dumont, NJ

Ghost:

We have 3 new Hatori pipes for 91Hx engine on order. I do not know the designation but I will let you know when I know the model number. We will be flying sb18s until the new model shows up though.

As for the header, most likely it will not change.

www.justinchi.com
08-21-2008 03:17 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
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Align T-REX 600N 700N > T-REX 700N The Align engine is released
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