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Ace Hobby . Esprit Model . Thunder Power RC

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JR Heli Vibe - Airskipper - Sylphide - Venture > 600N Pro is gonna lose to the Vibe 50
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

Quote 
I can add to this mess in confirming that what gear ratios should do in theory and what they actually do in real life is sometimes seriously something different. Please don't ask my why but we've done this in controlled testing with accurate equipment, needless to say we're still puzzled. This testing was done on my F3C machines where we really thought the one gear ratio was much more suited for the RPM ranges we were running at and it simply was not the case.

A bit like why a YS91st won't pull the skin of a rice pudding unless you use the 8.45 ratio in a R90, yet on an 8 to 1 in a Vibe 90 its an animal??

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
05-14-2008 11:15 PM
 
 
tchavei
rrProfessor
Location: Portugal

Probably.

If you want to get really confused, check out the Vibe 50 box... "8.7 ratio optimized for the YS50ST"

Knowing that the YS doesn't like as high rpms as the hyper (seems that some of my friends start having issues at 2200rpm+) then it would be more logical to have a lower ratio with the YS.

Lol, I'm confused myself. I only know that since last weekend, my official recommendation is:

radix Sbs 600mm (126gr) + YS50ST + Hatori #522 + V paddles + 2050 rpm = Bombastic.

Just don't be as stupid as me and don't start doing pushover auto practice

Tony


--------------------
"Perfection and patience usually walk side by side..."
05-14-2008 11:28 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Spacey
Senior Heliman
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

Droid: Yeh sounds like a similar thing. The day we figure this one out we'll update everyone on matters but the jury is still out. I can also add the jury is about as confused as a Star Wars fanatic at a My little pony convention.

Tony: You just ruined it for me? I was so hoping to start doing the inverted push out auto thing this weekend? Keep me posted when it's safe to try again will you?
05-15-2008 07:52 AM
 
 
tchavei
rrProfessor
Location: Portugal

lol

Its quite save I suppose but you need to get creative with the SBs. They loose rpm quite fast so they are probably not the best choice if you're starting out on a windless day.

I just rebuilt mine so I have to test it out and see if there are some hidden vibrations but I'm not so sure I'll hit that TH switch inverted that soon. Maybe I should take my regular radix with me instead.

Tony


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"Perfection and patience usually walk side by side..."
05-15-2008 11:11 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
DS 8717
rrProfessor
Location: Here wishing i was somewhere else

Quote 

Knowing that the YS doesn't like as high rpms as the hyper (seems that some of my friends start having issues at 2200rpm+) then it would be more logical to have a lower ratio with the YS.
The YS porting is more suited higher RPM's than the OS,the OS has mild porting,With that being said 17,000 is going to be about the max RPM of the power curve on either engine. Sure a heli might fly better at 2200 or 2300 headspeed but the engine is way out of it's power band.
05-15-2008 12:07 PM
 
 
tchavei
rrProfessor
Location: Portugal

It might be suited for high rpms (port wise) but from what I've heard it starts to wear out pretty bad at those high rpms.

Tony


--------------------
"Perfection and patience usually walk side by side..."
05-15-2008 12:10 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
DS 8717
rrProfessor
Location: Here wishing i was somewhere else

I have found out just the oposite,the OS looses power faster than the YS,the YS holds it's compression longer than the OS.I have a YS that i bought 2 yeasr ago and just now having to put a ring in it.I have been running it at 2050 headspeed since i bought it. You need to get the RPM just above the power curve when it's unloaded so it will drop into the top of the power band when its loaded,17,500 seems to be about right when it's unloaded.This is with a proper muffler,not some std 2 chamber thing like a SB 50 or TT muffler. I also found the MP 5 not making the power at the 17,00 range like a 522 or SAB 50.The earlier MP 2's worked great on the YS,when they changed the muffle section on the MP5 they killed the power.From what i hear theres a new version of the MP coming to fix the power problem.
05-15-2008 12:24 PM
 
 
tchavei
rrProfessor
Location: Portugal

yes. I agree. I've been running my YS at 17850 (2050 on the head) with great results. What I'm saying is that at 2200-2300 it will start wear out fast.

Tony


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"Perfection and patience usually walk side by side..."
05-15-2008 01:18 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
reiserrob2003
Senior Heliman
Location: Brockton, MA.

Although JR quality is uncompromising, Align has always been on the for front of getting an endless array of nice parts out there at a reasonable price. I hope JR will continue to follow suit with the release of the Vibe 50. I'm curious to see what types of upgrades will be offered and at what kind of price. And don't forget timeliness is another important factor. There's no doubt they did not skimp on the Vibe 50 quality but lets see if they can continue the trend.
05-15-2008 03:45 PM
 
 
DS 8717
rrProfessor
Location: Here wishing i was somewhere else

I have the Vibe 50 and i dont see anything that needs upgrading for better performance.There might be some bling some people might want,but the heli as it is now is needs nothing to improve performance other than blades and paddles.
05-15-2008 04:46 PM
 
 
BarracudaHockey
rrMaster
Location: Orange Park FL

What he said. Though I'm still flying mine with the stock tail blades and paddles.

Some people will want metal grips.


AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com
05-15-2008 04:56 PM
 
 
dhc8guru
Senior Heliman
Location: Texas

After looking through the Trex 600N forum, I am convinced there are 47700 posting of problems with the Rex... Glad I didn't go that route. My Rex's didn't have any problems so I don't know if Align built some crap or people are just complaining.
05-15-2008 05:52 PM
 
 
reiserrob2003
Senior Heliman
Location: Brockton, MA.

you mean 47,700 builder errors, my 600n never had any problems, and if it ever did I'd blame myself first. Very well thought out machine. One thing that bothers me about the Vibes are the bolt and nut setup that holds the frame together, Align just uses the spacer and two bolts so you can basically take one side of the frame off without breaking down the whole heli.
06-05-2008 04:48 PM
 
 
reiserrob2003
Senior Heliman
Location: Brockton, MA.

I'd like some metal grips and metal flybar control. The point I was trying to make is the heli is only one half of the deal, it isn't any good if the company doesn't support it, by support it I mean getting parts out there and keeping the price reasonable.
06-05-2008 05:02 PM
 
 
reiserrob2003Senior Heliman - Location: Brockton, MA. -


The Vibe does look like a good addition to the fleet though, Now I just need to get my Vibe 90 and Raptor Titan together.
06-05-2008 05:05 PM
 
 
tchavei
rrProfessor
Location: Portugal

Quote 
One thing that bothers me about the Vibes are the bolt and nut setup that holds the frame together, Align just uses the spacer and two bolts so you can basically take one side of the frame off without breaking down the whole heli.

Thats precisely why the 600N is so flimsy and you're going to pay for it when you crash. Unfortunately I railed in my vibe more than any other heli I ever owned and I have yet to break or scratch the frames. The entire structure is super rigid and doesn't flex even when you step on it. Btw, did you know that each vibe frame spacer is mere 0.3gr while each align spacer is 3gr? 10 vibe spacers weight the same as 1 align one. The price you pay is that you have to work on more screws when you want to change the frame... well my bet is that there is a 3:1 frame break ratio between the 600N and the Vibe. You're going to spend alot of time swapping 600N frames while the vibe frames just last and last. I owned a 600N for 6 months and broke 2 bottom frames and 1 side frame in the process. On the vibe I keep breaking landing gears and main shafts everytime I dump it in the ground but frame damage... nothing yet.

About builder errors... yes, you're right. Most of them are... just like on any heli. When tolerances allow a builder to screw up, he certainly will.

my two cents

Tony


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"Perfection and patience usually walk side by side..."
06-05-2008 05:20 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
RappyTappy
Elite Veteran
Location: Las Vegas, NV

Quote 
One thing that bothers me about the Vibes are the bolt and nut setup that holds the frame together

That type of technique has been used on rc helis since the beginning, I've never heard a issue before so why would it be a issue now? Things that are built to last are not always easy to work on.

Chris
Xero G

Forever Brothers
Mickey Tylo
06-05-2008 05:32 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
DWS6
Veteran
Location: Newark,DE

besides there are only a few that through bolt anyway. Front tray/stiffener, motot mount, tail brace and front skid mount

Dave
R90 / Vibe 50 / T-Rex SE / T-Rex 600N
06-05-2008 07:21 PM
 
 
Nate735
Senior Heliman
Location: New Jersey

Quote 


I am trying to figure out how Align is getting $600 for there bird, either JR is selling them cheap or Align is running fat.

I think JR is making a HUGE EFFORT selling at $ 599 with this Quality.

On the other hand Align is making a fortune selling at $ 600.

Just my point of view...

Who's paying 599 for a 600 pro ? thats insane. I don't think anyone pays MSRP for a t600. There all over the web for 430-500

amain: 469 http://www.amainhobbies.com/product...oducts_id/13908
grand rc: 429.0 http://www.grandrc.com/inc/sdetail/101997

At these real world prices.. i think the trex 600 is a great kit for the price. I haven't had a chance to fly a Vibe 50 yet, but i really like the simplicity and the low parts count on the Trex 600. The vibe looks a bit more complicated to build and a bit more expensive (kit & spares). I'm sure it flies great though !
06-05-2008 08:07 PM
 
 
BarracudaHockey
rrMaster
Location: Orange Park FL

If you'd built them back to back Nate, like I did its obvious the Vibe is head and shoulders above the 600n and if you replace the parts on the Align that are plastic on the Vibe I think the costs will be pretty darn close.


AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com
06-05-2008 08:40 PM
 
 
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JR Heli Vibe - Airskipper - Sylphide - Venture > 600N Pro is gonna lose to the Vibe 50
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