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3D Heli Depot . JR-Spektrum . Gyro Hobbies

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Aerial Photography and Video > Need help setting up a T12Zh with Hilicommand
 
 
Crazy-Joe
Heliman
Location: Germany

Hi nooobs,
sorry for not getting your point. You are totally correct in all your statements, nothing to add :-)
Cheers,
Joe
06-10-2008 11:51 AM
 
 
Qinetiqemc
Heliman
Location: Somerset - UK

I'm using a DX6i with the 6200e receiver but because I use the internal gyro, the "gear" plug that is programmed already by the radio to operate the Gyro gain is available. Unfortunately there is only a two position switch...good news is I can set the "gyro gain" to the switch. This radio runs from 0% to 100% gyro gain...but for running the Helicommand, about 50% is Red, and 70% is green...0% is orange.
This applies to the Spektrum DX6i with AR6100e (but same techniques might apply to others).

I have the Pilot Channel plugged into the Gear (gyro gain) on the RX.

These settings are in the "Adjust List" menu. (Bottom of the "Setup List" menu)

I set MIX1 as follows

GYRO -> GYRO ACT
RATE D 0% U -99%
SW GYRO TRIM ACT

I set GYRO as follows

RATE SW-F.MODE
0: 18.5% NORM 0
1: 86.5% STUNT 1

So what does this do?

When I have the F.MODE (gear) switch in '0', and GYRO (Flap) switch in '0' (down) HeliCommand is Horizontal Mode (orange).
When I have F.Mode 0 and GYRO 1 then I am still in Horizontal Mode (orange)
When I have F.Mode 1 and GYRO 1 then I am in OFF (red)
When I have F.Mode 1 and GYRO 0 then I am in Position Mode (green)

The F.MODE switch by itself goes from Horizontal to Position Mode. The Gyro switch cuts it back to red (OFF). When the F.MODE switch is off '0' there is nothing for the MIX1 to do so the gyro switch doesn't do anything at that point but when F.MODE goes to 1 NOW the MIX1 can do something.

It is hard to follow, but if you have the HeliCommand software you can see it in action.

As you can see in the GYRO settings, you can still adjust the amount of Pilot channel just change the GYRO rate that the F.MODE switch controls.

Ian
06-10-2008 11:44 PM
 
 
Red-Rx7
Senior Heliman
Location: Olathe, KS - USA

Glitching?

Hello all....

I have my HeliCommand Rigid connected and installed in my Vario Benzin Trainer 8301; and I don't feel comfortable with how it is operating. I took a video showing what I am talking about.

Textual version:

It looks like the servos are glitching.

In "Red" mode, they look to be glitching a very tiny amount. I can mostly just hear them, but I can also see them move every once in a while.

In "Yellow" mode, it is worse than "Red", but not that much different. They seem to move more in this mode.

In "Green" they are walking all over the place.

The helicopter is sitting on the ground, perfectly still during these tests.

Below is the video. It is 23mb in size:

http://www.corvettedyno.com/vario/S1050329.AVI

My next step is to undo my wiring job and try to seperate everything. Yet, it is a pain in the butt to do this; and I wanted to get some feedback from everyone in here.

EDIT: I undid all of my wiring, and had the receiver, helicommand connection module and all wires seperated. I just did the test of the 3 servos plugged into the HC, and all connections into the RX. It still moves like it did in the video.

Thanks,
Mike
06-21-2008 09:37 PM
 
 
Panomaniac
Senior Heliman
Location: Croatia - Adriatic coast

I didn't understud you if you had PC connection at the time you recorded that video, but from what i have found, that PC cable can produce some significant glitches.
06-22-2008 07:18 PM
 
 
nooobs
Key Veteran
Location: Toronto, Canada

I can't remember the full details of this issue. But I think the early production models had this "movement". It's perfectly fine to fly with this. If you really want to get rid of it I think you may have to contact Captron to return the unit for an update.

My HC3A and Rigid does the same thing. I've had no problems.
06-22-2008 07:55 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
pasi
Heliman
Location: Helsinki - Finland

I am kind of curious, why you put Rigid version of helicommand to Vario benzin trainer? I assume that you still got flybar on that?!?
06-22-2008 07:55 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Red-Rx7
Senior Heliman
Location: Olathe, KS - USA

Thanks for the replies.

The movement is scary looking though. Yet, it doesn't seem like it really affects the servo controls, other than it just moves a whole bunch. I am just afraid of how that would transpire to action in the air.

I will put it back together and go give it a shot.

In regards to the Rigid on the Vario; eventually I will fly it in a scale model without a flybar.
06-22-2008 08:16 PM
 
 
nooobs
Key Veteran
Location: Toronto, Canada

pasi

You can use Rigid on anything. You can disable/enable Rigid mode.


Red-Rx7

Go for it! Best to bring a laptop to the field so you can adjust the max gain in the software. As a tip from rerazor, it's best to hit max just before it oscillates.

Check the diagnose tab and make sure everything moves in the correct direction. Then do a bench test and make sure the swash moves in the opposite direction from how you tilt it.

Good luck!
06-22-2008 08:23 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
nooobs
Key Veteran
Location: Toronto, Canada

HeliCommand FAQ - #18

FYI...

Digital servos: minor servo jitter, major servo jitter!

One effect of the auto-pilot is to cause the servos to be just perceptibly "nervous" (constant minor movements) even when the model is stationary. This applies in particular if you are using high-speed digital servos. The movement is uncritical. It may result from the signal output rate or from minor fluctuations in measured values, as frequently occur with conventional tail gyros and tail rotor servos. Since using a HeliCommand means that the constant movement affects four servos, this can certainly increase the current drain of the receiver battery. However, in practice this mainly occurs when the model is flying, when all the servos are operating as "control loop" servos; they certainly operate more often than they would if "manually controlled" by an average pilot. Incidentally, this "extra workload" is present whether you notice the fluctuations on the ground or not; it's just that you don't hear the servos working when the model is in the air. In fact the degree to which the servos have to "work hard" depends much more on the level at which the regulatory system is working in the air, and on the gain setting, i.e. whether the HeliCommand is set towards the "agile" or "smooth" end of the scale.

It is not really significant if the servos appear to be working slightly more than usual when the helicopter is on the ground.

None of this applies if you suffer severe servo jitter.

The cause for this may be that the internal fail-safe is over-responsive ("too sharp" - this was the case with the first few examples shipped. (With many RC systems, and with certain combinations of equipment, the fail-safe then thinks it has detected interference to the radio link, even though the RC system is working perfectly; it may then switch the servos to the set fail-safe positions for a brief period. If this happens with your HeliCommand, it is essential to have the unit updated (at no charge). A direct express service has been set up by the manufacturer to correct this specific fault. The only devices affected are those whose type placard does not bear a data code (two-characters or four-digits) to the left of the Order Number).
06-23-2008 04:20 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Red-Rx7
Senior Heliman
Location: Olathe, KS - USA

Thanks for the update!

Next weekend I will get to "officially" try it. Read here to see what happened when I tried to go up:

http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t440829p1/

Mike
06-24-2008 12:14 AM
 
 
nooobs
Key Veteran
Location: Toronto, Canada

Mike

Just really glad you're ok. You'll get her up in the air.
06-24-2008 12:38 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ErBr
Heliman
Location: Montreal, Canada

Great thread guys!

For myself, I am trying to figure how to set the Auto-trim function on my X9303. My pilot channel on the 3 positions F. mode switch but I do not know what to do for the Auto-trim... Can I use the aux1 switch and just move the switch (in flight) for a second to activate the auto-trim?

-- Give me a chance, I am a french-speaking Canadian. Merci beaucoup! --
10-02-2008 06:51 PM
 
 
daytonabeach
Key Veteran
Location: Oslo, Norway

A spring switch is the easiest way to enable auto trim, and yes, a brief push on that activates the autotrim...

Voila

Never argue with an idiot, he'll drag you down to his level and beat you with experience...
10-02-2008 06:57 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ErBr
Heliman
Location: Montreal, Canada

Quote 
A spring switch is the easiest way to enable auto trim, and yes, a brief push on that activates the autotrim...

Voila

Yes, I know that but I am not able to figure how to set the trainer switch on the X9303 in order to be usable as the autotrim switch... I think it is not possible.

-- Give me a chance, I am a french-speaking Canadian. Merci beaucoup! --
10-02-2008 07:08 PM
 
 
nooobsKey Veteran - Location: Toronto, Canada -
Hope this helps...

From the manual

10-02-2008 07:18 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ErBr
Heliman
Location: Montreal, Canada

Great Nooob, I will check that.

Thanks for your input. Unfortunately, I did install my helicommand last weekend, after sratching my head many times, but fund "your" thread only few days ago...

EDIT: I have plugged the HC AUX wire to the AUX3 channel of my receiver and reassigned the 2 position switch ELEV D/R to the AUX3 channel. Its works great whitout any additionnal tuning for AUTOTRIM

-- Give me a chance, I am a french-speaking Canadian. Merci beaucoup! --
10-03-2008 12:09 AM
 
 
avalon
Heliman
Location: Sydney Australia

Great thread, has answered nearly all of my questions. I am using a DX7 I have assigned the 3 flight modes red,green, and yellow to the Flight switch, and all the other mixing and swash controls seam to be going in the right direction. I wish to use the inbuilt gyro for the tail, I have the gray wire on the gear channel. Do I set the gain there for the gyro?. Is the gyro in HH on one side of the switch and rate on the other as per a conventional gyro?If so how do I know which is which. Thanks in advance.

There I was inverted nothing on the clock but the makers name and only the joystick in my hand
10-03-2008 02:32 PM
 
 
nooobs
Key Veteran
Location: Toronto, Canada

Quote 
I have the gray wire on the gear channel.

The gray wire is for "Autotrim". Are you using the gear channel for Autotrim?

The yellow wire is for the tail gyro.
10-03-2008 04:59 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
avalon
Heliman
Location: Sydney Australia

nooobs. Thanks for your reply. I have been trying to find out the right way to set this up and have been reading anything I can find about it. I must have got confused with your post on page 1 point 4 about Gyro auto trim. OK so if the gray wire is auto trim I will have to leave that on the gear switch as I do not have any channels left (looks like I need a DX9). The yellow wire is plugged into channel 4 (rudder). I know that you said you have not used the inbuilt gyro but as I am putting this in a scale heli frame I was hoping it would do the job. That is why I was asking about heading hold rate mode (if it has those) and gain. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

There I was inverted nothing on the clock but the makers name and only the joystick in my hand
10-04-2008 04:59 AM
 
 
nooobsKey Veteran - Location: Toronto, Canada -
The built in gyro should be enough.

Yes there is a HH and Normal position you can set on the software and others gains you can set.

10-04-2008 05:29 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
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