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Blitz Helicopters Avro 90 > Head setup options
 
 
marked23
Key Veteran
Location: Lynnwood, WA

I'm trying to decide how I want to setup the head. The instructions show three setups. Some of the setups have the main grips flipped over.

Does this mean that the swashplate moves differently for collective changes? (up = down)

For asthetic reasons, I'd prefer having the swash plate move normally. Is there a full 3D setup option to do that?

-Mark
03-21-2008 08:44 PM
 
 
Bond007
Senior Heliman
Location: Leicestershire UK

Quote 
Does this mean that the swashplate moves differently for collective changes? (up = down)

Yes

Quote 
For asthetic reasons, I'd prefer having the swash plate move normally. Is there a full 3D setup option to do that?

No

I don't get your reasoning for the above statement

You can't see it when your flying, so what difference 'asthetically' does it make

Blitz Avro, Vibe 50
03-21-2008 09:11 PM
 
 
marked23
Key Veteran
Location: Lynnwood, WA

Quote 
what difference 'asthetically' does it make

Well, I've never worked with a swashplate that ran that way. I don't want to get myself confused during preflight. Not sure how annoying that would be. Does it tilt for cyclic differently too?

I've heard of other people doing grip flips on other helis and saying that it made no difference. So I figure that I could just use the 3D ratios and leave the grips in the normal position.

Unless there is a real geometry change that takes place by flipping the grips, I'm unconvinced that it makes that much of a difference. (though I'm welcome to having the difference explained to me.)

-Mark
03-21-2008 09:32 PM
 
 
Bond007
Senior Heliman
Location: Leicestershire UK

Quote 
Does it tilt for cyclic differently too?

No. The cyclic movement will stay the same.

I always look at the blades when I preflight the collective, not the swashplate. Works for me.

It's only the up/down movement of the swash that will change. With Leading edge grips the swash goes down with positive pitch.

I have flown with the 'Sport/3D' setup with L/E grips, and the 'FAI/stable' setup, with T/E grips. There is a noticeable difference between them. The machine is a lot more lively and responsive in the 3D setup. I have also tried varying settings in these setups, and each time it was worse than the settings given in the manual.

If you want to 3D, then use the manual settings for 'sport/3D' or 'Full 3D'. If you want to do FAI style, then use the 'FAI/stable' settings.

I would not recommend varying from the manual. Set it up as per your desired flying style, fly it and enjoy.

Sean

Blitz Avro, Vibe 50
03-22-2008 10:12 AM
 
 
The Old Guy
Senior Heliman
Location: UK Surrey

Bond is absolutly right, go by the book for whichever setup you wont and you will not be disapointed!!!!!
03-22-2008 12:29 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
e-copter
Senior Heliman
Location: Nice, France

Hi Guys,

i'm not really sure it changes anything on the pitch movement over the swashplate.
When you go from trailing edge to leaeding edge, if you check carefully your manual, you need also to flip 180° the flybar pivot which inverts the anchor points, so normally the swash movement stays exaclty the same (washout is turned 180° as well). People who have own a Beginner 15 or EP Concept will know why i mean
I'll unmount my head to check this out and i'll let you know

BEst regards,
Fabien
03-22-2008 01:27 PM
 
 
delhezi18
Senior Heliman
Location: jakarta,indonesia

anywhere that i can download the manual online?
03-22-2008 02:55 PM
 
 
Bond007
Senior Heliman
Location: Leicestershire UK

Quote 
With Leading edge grips the swash goes down with positive pitch.

Oops....I got this the wrong way round

With T/E grips the swash goes down with positive pitch.

Quote 
i'm not really sure it changes anything on the pitch movement over the swashplate.

Fabien Trust me, when you change the grips from L/E to T/E, it reverses the collective action. I know because I have done this. You have to adjust the rods that go from the swash to the mixing arms, to reset everything level at 0 degrees pitch as well, because it does alter slightly.

Quote 
anywhere that i can download the manual online?

http://www.blitz-helicopters.com/

Sean

Blitz Avro, Vibe 50
03-22-2008 03:25 PM
 
 
e-copter
Senior Heliman
Location: Nice, France

Hi Sean,
as i said i needed to check this out as i'm not sure about it,
Thanks for confirming it to me anyway

I know i made a mod on an EP cocnept rotor head this way veryy long time ago for a customer( going from trailing to leading edge) and there is a tip with the washout out to invert ( flippping it, not rotating it). As i'm a dumb head, i'll try this anyway on the Avro and let you know the results of my stupids experiences .
Anyway, the fact the swashplate needs to go down for pitch up is not a problem at all, it's the way it works with Henseleit rotorheads on the 3DNT, depending on the rotation direction you use on the main rotor, and it works very well

Best regards,

Fabien
03-22-2008 07:53 PM
 
 
marked23
Key Veteran
Location: Lynnwood, WA

Ok I've looked more into this. My initial question is moot. It appears the 3D setups are L/E grips. Which means that the swash moves normally.

If I were going to set it up for FAI/Stable, then that would make the swashplate move in the opposite collective direction.

I'm not doing Stable, so I got nothing to worry about.

-Mark
03-23-2008 01:25 AM
 
 
e-copter
Senior Heliman
Location: Nice, France

Hi Mark,

even with the leading edge / 3D setup, you would be really surprised how the heli stable is in hovering. I use no expo at all to keep a solid hover even with wind, when i was using at least 20% expo on my other machines.

If you are doing hard 3D, then there are special delrin insert you can use to prevent boomstrike in extreme manoevers( anyway i never had any troubles with the originals " pistons" ).
they replace the stocks ones.

Just make sure that you setup correctly the gears free play as well for solid 3D and especially insanes stops after fast ff flight( take the time needed for that operation) to ensure maximum gyro efficiency and to have your crown gear last as long as you heli will land on it's skids

BEst regards,

Fabien
03-23-2008 02:21 AM
 
 
Bond007
Senior Heliman
Location: Leicestershire UK

marked23

I'm not being funny mate, but if your that worried about a swash plate that goes down when the pitch indreases, and getting confused, are you sure your ready for this machine

Blitz Avro, Vibe 50
03-23-2008 11:32 AM
 
 
marked23
Key Veteran
Location: Lynnwood, WA

It's an asthetic thing.
I'm the kind of person that if I can't have it my way, I want to know why. So I'm asking. If it had turned out that I really couldn't have it my way, then I'd live with that, but I'd still want to know.

Anyway, yeah. No worries about if I'm "ready for" this heli.

-Mark
03-23-2008 04:51 PM
 
 
Bond007
Senior Heliman
Location: Leicestershire UK

Cool

Are you going for the Full 3D set up then ?

Sean

Blitz Avro, Vibe 50
03-23-2008 04:57 PM
 
 
marked23
Key Veteran
Location: Lynnwood, WA

I haven't decided to go with Sport3d or Full 3d. I have the 3d insert kit. So I figure I'll put those in regardless of which mixer arm ratio I go with.

I have my Fury Extreme setup for "normal" flight and I'm able to do my kind of 3d with that just fine. So I'm leaning to trying the Sport setup first.

-Mark
03-23-2008 05:51 PM
 
 
Bond007
Senior Heliman
Location: Leicestershire UK

Probably a wise move. It is plenty responsive with that setup

And you can get used to the feel of the model

Keep us updated on your progress.

Sean

Blitz Avro, Vibe 50
03-23-2008 09:12 PM
 
 
John Benario
Senior Heliman
Location: Atlanta

If you use the hard o-rings that come in the 3D pack the head will wobble at the bottom of autos. I ended up with one hard oring inside and one soft o-ring on the outside and there is just the tiniest bit of wobble at the bottom of the autos. Remember the yoke width is wider than the X-cell and most others so the response is very fast.

John Benario
03-27-2008 01:45 AM
 
 
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Blitz Helicopters Avro 90 > Head setup options
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