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Engines Plugs Mufflers Fuel > Thunder Tiger Redline .53
 
 
alfred
Veteran
Location: Australia, New South Wales, Mid North Coast

I would suggest not to play with that adjustment unless absolutely required.
Quite a few don't have an issue around midpoint and it would also depend which muffler is being used.
Once the engine is run in and if you still have a problem then yes..go ahead.
I am going to try mine with the original TT50 muffler and see how it goes first, while keeping the Governor off until sorted.
03-03-2008 06:12 AM
 
 
Kiwi Raptor
Heliman
Location: Nelson New Zealand

Arceye
I have had the same problem as you. When running on the curves the 53 runs well. However, if I am hovering with I would guess 1900 on the head using the throttle curve and then engage the govenor which is set to 1750, the engine goes very lean and nuts off for 5 - 10 secs before settling back to 1750.If I cut straight to idle up 2 where the govenor set is to 1950 there is no problem The only way I have been able to stop this is to richen the low speed but this has made the spool up very sluggish . I had the engine quit in flight the other day. This happened after a quick decent and then putting the power back on, resulting in sudden silence. I am guessing the govenor backed off the throttle on the decent bringing it into the lean point and then opening the throttle again resulted in the engine failure
You said you moved the needle ( part J ) 1/8 of a turn. I assume this is anticlockwise,ie moving the needle away from the other half ( the spray bar) Is this correct???

T Rex 700 Raptor 50 Mini Titan
Kiwi's can fly
03-03-2008 07:29 AM
 
 
Arild Johansen
Heliman
Location: Norway, Flateby

Which dimension of bearings is used on the TT53. Is it the same dimension as for the OS50 Hyper?

For you those of you that have used the TT53 for a while, is the power significant better than the OS Hyper? I have seen some videos of the TT53 but the guys have way more headspeed than I use to have on my Raptor 50. Therefore I find it a little difficult to compare the power seen on the videos for what I would experience if a bought one. I find the speed of 2100 rpm to be a compromise between good response and power and not beating the **** out of my Raptor 50 ;-)

Arild Johansen
03-03-2008 08:43 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
arceye
Veteran
Location: UK

alfred:
Quote 
I would suggest not to play with that adjustment unless absolutely required
I completely agree and stated as much when I originally posted that it was adjustable.

Kiwi Raptor:
yes that is correct, please note, after you have adjusted the part J you WILL need to lean the low end somewhat leaner than the stock setting to get a good idle.

Arild Johansen:
The power is a significant change without doubt, When I used the hyper I tried 2100 on the head and although it had great performance it was working quite a bit above its best power range so under load it would slow quite a lot but then it would hold power, where as the redline is designed to run at the higher speed (I guess its timed different) so when loaded in the same way it doesn't drop off anywhere near as much and holds more power.
Video's just don't do the engine justice and can't show the real differences especially when the pilot in the video has the ability to make even an OS32 look powerfull.

Andy


Kasama Head :(
The Blingiest DOWNGRADE a Raptor can have
03-03-2008 12:14 PM
 
 
blbills
Veteran
Location: Provo, UT

Any flight reports with the MP2?

Brian
03-03-2008 08:08 PM
 
 
Andy from Sandy
Veteran
Location: UK

The back bearing is NTN 6902. It is the same size as the bearing used in the OS 50. 15x28x7
03-03-2008 08:51 PM
 
 
WJackson
Key Veteran
Location: Smyrna, Delaware

Yes it is.

Bill Jackson
03-03-2008 08:54 PM
 
 
v58 fuy
Veteran
Location: UK - Tunbridge Wells, Kent

Guys,

Only time will tell but I think NTN are a good bearing company, not sure about the make of the OS bearing.

One thing I noted today (could only fly once because of the weather) but up until now I've used an OS 8 plug because the TT plugs weren't available originally when I got my engine. So in the beginning I decided to tune it with the OS 8, but today I decided to try the R3 TT plug which came with the engine - got to say it seemed to really like it, think it's a bit hotter than an OS 8 but not certain.

David
03-03-2008 09:00 PM
 
 
Andy from Sandy
Veteran
Location: UK

OS also use NTN
03-03-2008 09:28 PM
 
 
Kiwi Raptor
Heliman
Location: Nelson New Zealand

Arceye

I have been giving the idea of moving the internal needle some thought and i can't see how it will make any difference. I'll try to explain my thinking.

With the 53 the low speed adjustment screw works by moving the ENTIRE spray bar either closer to or further away from the internal needle. Now if you wind the interal needle anticlockwise it will move away from the spray bar. In order to correct the now rich idle you have to turn the low speed screw inwards ( leaner ) which moves the spray baar inwards. This will now re-establish the same relationship between the spray bar and the internal needle that existed before except that the spray bar is slightly further out in the middle of the carb throat

You can't change the pitch of the thread that controls how much the thottle body moves out as it rotates so it seems to me that the internal needle will move out of the spray bar in the same way as before and with the same relationship to the air intake opening

Does this make sense or have I missd something here

I am keen to find a way to be able to get the low speed as lean as it needs to be with out getting the over lean mid range

I look forward to your thoughts

Cheers

Ross

T Rex 700 Raptor 50 Mini Titan
Kiwi's can fly
03-05-2008 06:52 AM
 
 
alfred
Veteran
Location: Australia, New South Wales, Mid North Coast

Quote 
Does this make sense or have I missd something here

I don't think that you are missing something and if this would be a plane engine then all would be fine.
But because we run helies who change there load constantly and we ask them to run a set rpm while the load changes, it's a different story. Our carbies can't be linear anymore as we need ours to be rich in the midrange and leaner at both the low and high ends due to large load changes.
So this is "my" theory as what is happening:

The carby is designed to be "rich" in the midrange.
Due to different muffler/rpm/loads that everybody uses, the low load condition i.e zero degree pitch is at a different part of the throttle opening for every person. So all they are doing is move the midrange (rich spot) up or down the barrel opening to fit the no load position and the rpm that you are running and maybe compensate the for the particular muffler that is in use.
I am happy to be proven wrong or hear other peoples ideas.
03-05-2008 09:12 AM
 
 
arceye
Veteran
Location: UK

Kiwi Raptor:

If you suggest that moving the low end mixture actually physically moves the spray bar in and out I will believe you although I can't physically see how unless it is on some kind of worm screw (but I didn't actually look when mine was apart), As far as I am aware it just restricts the amount of fuel that travels through the spray bar when it is closed off by the internal needle.
My whole way of thinking (which worked for me) is that by moving the internal needle away from the spray bar changes the point of transition between the low and high needles.
The main point is that it is at the transition point where my engine was lean so by moving that transition point to occur at low throttle (where there is less air) it enabled me to totally avoid the lean point when I am on my chosen low head speed, I am pretty sure if I tried hard enough I could find another point at which it is lean because of me moving the transition but that would probably be at a seriously low head speed which I would never run.


Andy


Kasama Head :(
The Blingiest DOWNGRADE a Raptor can have
03-05-2008 01:54 PM
 
 
national
Heliman
Location: Lebanon

pdf manual is here

http://210.202.20.209/upload/2008-1/20081261441.pdf
03-05-2008 04:37 PM
 
 
alfred
Veteran
Location: Australia, New South Wales, Mid North Coast

Andy
I just went and had a look as there are different carbies out there.
The TT53's Barrel does move in and out when you open/close the throttle.
And as the spraybar is part of the barrel, so does it.

Just to make it clear for me Andy.
You turned the spraybar 1/8 "anticlockwise"?
03-05-2008 07:14 PM
 
 
Arild Johansen
Heliman
Location: Norway, Flateby

I must admit that I’m a little sceptical to TT engines. I have owned and used their 39-PRO and 50-PRO and wasn’t to impressed by these motors. But I’m so curious at new stuff that can give better flying conditions to my helicopters that I had to order a Redline yesterday for my Raptor V2. I’m very happy with my nearly 3 year old Hyper witch has swallowed around 30-40 gallon of fuel without any other trouble than changing the bearings ones in a while. Now that I see there is a workaround for a probably lean spot that I had problem with my old TT engines I feel comfortable enough to try the Redline. Next choice is if I should try a Carbsmart or not. Any opinions?

Arild Johansen
03-06-2008 08:51 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
arceye
Veteran
Location: UK

Kiwi Raptor: The low needle does as you suggest move the spray bar in and out against the needle which I am referring to and so in your defence it should be the same as me moving the Part J, which leads me to believe that just the moving of it won't work and the taper I put on the Part J is what has really made the difference.
When I originally did this mod and posted about it I did mention that I put a taper onto the internal needle but suggested that it may not be required, so at it happens I am now convinced that it is what made the real difference not just the adjustment of the part J.


Kasama Head :(
The Blingiest DOWNGRADE a Raptor can have
03-06-2008 12:29 PM
 
 
coops2
Senior Heliman
Location: New Zealand

Well I have just received my new motor

went for a redline, fitted it up last night very well made in my opinion motor came in the box with glow plug, manual and even a small tool kit with spanners and allen keys... simple thing but nice touch I purchased a RJX pipe for it too it I have been told suits the redline very well.... my only gripe would be that clutch nut!! for steel it was softer than butter!! as I was tightening it up you could feel it giving.. put it aside and used the old nut off the tt50pro felt way better and more positive. I have a carb smart but I wont be hooking it up to the needle yet I will run it in and get the feel for it first.... overall the service from the supplier and the motor was top notch
03-20-2008 09:32 PM
 
 
alfred
Veteran
Location: Australia, New South Wales, Mid North Coast

The once supplied here in Australia come with a 2nd nut due to the known issue of the original soft nut.
03-21-2008 01:03 AM
 
 
coops2
Senior Heliman
Location: New Zealand

well.........

here is my first thoughts on it with about two three tanks through it, tweaking and tuning I can now say I know how to tune a motor again, plenty of power and idles well but the factory settings are a little out I feel keeping it very rich at the moment however it was interesting to watch the carb smart servo react to my tuning the sensor is installed, servo installed but the control arm is removed it starts off at the full lean of course then in the hover slowly moves just to the left of centre position and does no wild swings just sits there.... until you put it down again and it slowly moves back to the lean position this is set at 100c I wont be running the carb smart until im sure I have it close to perfect
03-21-2008 02:03 AM
 
 
Sam2b
Key Veteran
Location: Seattle, WA - USA

I've posted detailed comments in this thread about the TT53.
http://www.runryder.com/?do=myposts...&topicid=376354

IMO, the TT53 has no check valves or diaphragms to worry about failing, AND the TT53 pulls and pulls and pulls, and doesn't bat an eye at what ever you throw at it. I wish I had a video to show.

_Sam B_
03-21-2008 02:45 AM
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