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Flybarless Rotor Head Systems > New Flybarless System
 
 
d_wheel
Veteran
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas.

Is it possible to have more than 1 setup with this system and switch between them in flight? If so, it might be advantageous to have one setup for lift off and landing with a more "natural" feel and behavior; with a second setup geared toward more vigorous flight behavior.

Later;

D.W.

Gettin old aint for sissies!
04-17-2008 05:41 PM
 
 
Bruce2.5D
Heliman
Location: Vancouver, Canada

>Is it possible to have more than 1 setup with this system and switch between them in flight?

That might be possible in future, using the spare input/output.

As things are, you can use the dual-rate switches on your radio for that purpose. Just set the gyro up using full travels, and then apply expo or a low rate feature of your radio.
04-17-2008 05:57 PM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

I've gotta say, the responsiveness that Bruce has displayed on here really increases my confidence in this product. I've pulled my Blade 400 off the classifieds to test the system out on.


Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-17-2008 06:08 PM
 
 
Kai_Shiden
Heliman
Location: Seattle, WA

I agree with Eury, Kudos to Skookum, I received the email with the cold test instructions and attached GUI setup file 15 minutes ago.

Excellent product support, it's a breath of fresh air after so many fire and forget product launches from manufacturers in general to see this level of communication from a new company. Keep up the good work and you'll build a loyal customer base.

I for one can't wait to try the SK360 out on a few of my helis.

-Kai
04-17-2008 07:33 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Unpoor
Heliman
Location: Ange Sweden

Mine works

I just tested mine and it appears to work..

OHH put it in setup mode to get it to init, scared me..

I have mine on a Rex-600N Pro, 9252 servos at 6V align reg.

Mod I made on the head was to reduse the space between the servoballs down too 20mm instead of original 35mm, lowered the swashmix down too 45% gave me 14+- and 8 degrees cyclic, I used a 75mm rod direct link to the grips but I whould recommend a 80mm rod to get some more threads into the link, it will hoold(jank hard tested) but I will feel better when ubersure, then turn the driver upside down, lock it with two M3/M4 allen screws drilled and tapped into the driver, cut the longer part of the washout control arm and put it back inside out, hard to get it over the swashballs but you need to turn it upside down otherwise it will interfere with the rod @ high throws, make sure the washout control arm knee whont bind, cut some plastic out otherwise, just a tad, im not a HC 3D pilot so the plastic will be more then ok, but a less flex driver/antiturn thingy will probably shine perfect also .

This is a real ezy mod to do, u dont have to cut the mixer arms either but heyy for to looks.. :-)

To get a nice spot for the gyro then remove the two upper screws for the front plastic tray, tilt it back until leveled and drill two new holes for the screws. perfect place and standard cables for the back servo will be loong enough..

Have fun.. I will

Pic of the head


T-Rex 600N Pro SK360, Hurricane 550, T-Rex Hybrid, DX7
04-17-2008 10:43 PM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

Mine showed up today. It looks like a nice package, I've got it in my freezer right now to cool it down so I can do the test on it.


Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-17-2008 10:55 PM
 
 
george0079
Elite Veteran
Location: Terra Firma

Customer Support is absolutely Amazing, for this product.

You think your kids are expensive now?

Just wait until they move out!!
04-17-2008 11:18 PM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

Just did the test, and mine passes. I'm probably going to freeze it again and double check, but it looks like it's fine. Bruce2.5d, can you explain to us exactly how the issue came about? Do you have multiple suppliers, and one of the suppliers provided a defective component? I ask because mine must be one of the early ones since I ordered it the day after they became available, and I'm wondering how some are defective, but others aren't. In my experience, if one is bad from something like this, they all are within a certain range. My serial # is 2685, how deep into the production run did the problem show up?

Your being forthcoming on the issue made the difference for me between returning it and keeping it, I do really appreciate you coming on here and helping us directly.

Also, if anyone is wondering about using the software on a Mac, I can confirm that it works perfectly in Parallels with XP on a Macbook Core2Duo running Leopard. Actually, I have yet to find anything that doesn't work, which is good, because I don't own a PC.


Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-17-2008 11:26 PM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

Just did the test again. The instructions say that you freeze it and don't get it below -15c. Well, my freezer only gets down to -5c (20F) or so, and I let it sit in the freezer until it got there (according to my temp gun).

It still passes. I did notice that the init takes longer when its cold than when its warmed up. When I first plugged it in and it was at -5c (20F), it took about 30 seconds to init, and as it warmed up, it got progressively faster until it was room temp and it finished initializing in about 5 seconds.

It's earned the right to be flown, I'll be converting my Blade 400 tonight to test it out. Also, the new version of the software that was sent to me to test reset the Hiller delay to 100, so it should act more conventionally than the original software that had it at 25.


Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-18-2008 12:02 AM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

Converted the Blade 400. Pretty simple, that head design puts the balls right on the centerline of the head and spaces them out to where there's no binding and good resolution. The airframe changes took me about 20 minutes to pull all the flybar stuff off, there was already a link that went right up to the grips and was the right length, so all I did was add a set screw to the washout to lock it to the head, remove one of the washout arms, and cut the extra side off the arm I left on there to keep the swash from rotating. I also flipped the grips to leading edge. Dunno why, seems the in thing to do, and I want to be part of the cool crowd, I guess.

Electronic setup was easy by following the instructions. Initially I had the rotation off, so the SK360 was correcting 90deg off what it should be. Hooked it back up and it all works as advertised. Unfortunately it's raining out, so no test tonight, and tomorrow's supposed to be bad as well, so maybe no test then either. It's a pretty cool unit, and easy to setup, I did it so all the mixing is done in the SK360, and it all looks good. Can't wait to test it out. This heli flew very well out of the box, if this is a success, I'll move the mixer to something bigger.




Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-18-2008 02:53 AM
 
 
eggmcmuffinplz
Key Veteran
Location: Los Angeles, CA

AHHHH I want this Soooooo bad! Anyone flt it 3d yet?
04-18-2008 02:56 AM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

One more thing, I can definitely see where people could mess up the setup and kill a heli. The first time I set it up I thought it was all good from following the instructions, but a bit of inattention on my part meant that I missed the need to click the rotate 90deg button in the software. This resulted in the gyro correcting pitch with aileron, and vice versa. Didn't show up in setup unless I really paid attention to what each box said, since moving the sticks resulted in the correct movements of the swash, but getting out of setup mode showed the automatic corrections were wrong. It was pretty subtle, as well, the corrections are not large, and the first couple times i checked it I thought it was correct.

I can definitely see how someone could kill their heli with a wrong click in the software, it's like having your gyro reversed, except instead of spinning it'll drive itself into the ground if you don't get it right the first time.


Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-18-2008 03:02 AM
 
 
MrMel
Elite Veteran
Location: Lidingo, Sweden

an note for all new flybarless fliers,



Low headspeed does NOT equal slower cyclic as you have been used to before, it will be just as fast as full headspeed, for trial flight you need to lower the rollrate/fliprate by other means (in the program, or ATV in radio)
04-18-2008 04:54 AM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

It's not raining this morning and there is no wind, so I very excitedly went out to test it in my driveway. I'm disappointed to report that my experience is the same as everyone elses.

Spooling up, I can see it putting in full cyclic in various directions (I sat there watching it do this for about 10 seconds, so I know it was past the 5sec lockout mentioned earlier), and against my every instinct, I didn't touch the cyclic stick at all (in fact, I consciously wasn't touching it, I had my fingers just off the stick) and slowly brought the collective up. as it got light on the skids it dumped full cyclic over to the right, and I brought the stick down so it wouldn't crash. Spooled it up again, and this time popped it up quickly (again not touching the cyclic), it got to about 6 feet and was all over the place, on take off it got to within a couple of degrees of knife edge, I hit throttle hold and wrestled it back onto the skids. Stupidly, I decided to try one more time, this time taking off like normal and using a touch of cyclic to keep it steady like I would with any heli. Apparently I wasn't quick enough, because this time the tip of the blades hit the driveway, and I shut it down.

Total damage: $12 set of wood blades, and complete loss of confidence in the sk360. I went through the setup exactly according to the manual, and triple and quadruple checked that the settings were right. Everything is moving smoothly and in the correct direction, but the SK360 puts in full cyclic while its sitting on the ground. Why would it do that? It's not like it holds it either, it's like the unit is putting in random jabs in various directions.

Is there an "Instantly kill helicopter" button in the software that I accidentally clicked? Because I can't think of a more efficient way to kill a heli that to jam in full aileron as soon as it gets light on the skids.


Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-18-2008 01:40 PM
 
 
gorn
Elite Veteran
Location: Western Australia

That sucks bad. I was really hoping this was a viable alternative to CSM and Mikado. Apparently not........

If you bling it, they will come :D
04-18-2008 01:45 PM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

Lets not jump the gun on that. They have been responsive to issues so far, I'm curious to hear what their input is, and what box I can uncheck to turn off the instant heli destruction function.


Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-18-2008 01:47 PM
 
 
Bruce2.5D
Heliman
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Hi Eury,

Ok, new rule if I can suggest one :-)

If it does weird stuff on the ground, please pm or email before flying! I will try to respond within a few hours. Every new heli type's conversion is a small re-engineering project. Resist the temptation to just give it a go until it seems right.

Every unit is run through a bench test plan, and I've actually hovered with about 1/3 of the units that were shipped out with zero problems, so something is wrong with some people's setups that is unclear to me as of yet.

One note: micro helis with light blades can be - grouchy. As a "hard case" test I did get a stock Blade CP pro to work well, with wood blades and the standard controller, but it took longer. A little micro with wood blades has almost no inertia in the rotor disk and more vibration.

Eury's problem sounds like a vibration issue, but from the one photo it looks to be mounted right. Eury could you please email a photo of the SK360's mounting and your setup file?
04-18-2008 01:56 PM
 
 
gorn
Elite Veteran
Location: Western Australia

lol Im glad your still tryin to make it work

If you bling it, they will come :D
04-18-2008 01:56 PM
 
 
Eury
rrProfessor
Location: Ankeny, IA, USA.

Well, you didn't say that before. Honestly, from reading your posts it sounds like it's going to do all sorts of strange things on the ground and during takeoff, and they will go away in the air. Here's pics of the mounting, and screenshots of my setup. I think doing this publicly will help us all, maybe it can help others avoid the pitfalls we're falling into.

Please tell me what I am doing wrong. The heli is absolutely smooth without any vibration, and flew perfectly before. It does have the stock woodies (I guess I should say DID have the stock woodies), but they flew well, and actually did pretty damn good autos, so they aren't the lightest blades out there. The cables are tied together, but there is plenty of slack and the SK360 can move freely on the foam mounting pads.

Also, where can we get more of that foam tape? That stuff is great. It's a lot like Zeal Gel, but a tiny bit more rigid, and probably a lot less expensive.




Nick Crego
Still wanted by the government, I survive as a soldier of fortune.
04-18-2008 02:22 PM
 
 
JKos
Elite Veteran
Location: City of California in the state of Maryland

So is this now a total of three known tip-overs during takeoff? All to the right, I believe. Is there any correlation between options selected during configuration for these three cases?

Bruce,
Have you flight tested the unit in all possible physical orientations and all possible software configurations (directions/reversals, etc.)?

Thanks,
John

MSH Protos
04-18-2008 03:25 PM
 
 
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