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Radio - Servo - Gyro - Gov - Batt > JR 12x Update... release date info... sorta
 
 
JKos
Elite Veteran
Location: Town of California in the state of Maryland

I got to touch and feel a 12X yesterday. I didn't get to go through every menu and option, but I did take a look at the swash mix screen that it has for CCPM. No, it does not have every single swash detail setting exactly like the 12Z and 14MZ. But, I think some of the settings are simply achieved differently on the 12X versus those two.

What it does have... Pre-defined aileron to elevator and elevator to aileron mixes. Fully adjustable elevator input servo speed compensation (to eliminate unintended collective dance during fast elevator inputs). Fully adjustable swash expo (to eliminate reduced cyclic input and slight unintended collective input away from zero collective). I think those two adjustments go a long, long way to dialing out swash interactions.

What is achieved differently is that you level the swash at the top and bottom using travel adjusts instead of a mix settings. And as for the other predefined linkage compensation mixes of the 12Z and 14MZ, those could easily be reproduced using some of the eight available mixes of the 12X, five of which are 8-point curve mixes.

Some other tidbits... Six flight modes with user definable names. Up to eight-point pitch and throttle curves; you pick how many and where the points are located. Six swash plate types. Electronic cyclic ring. Throttle position triggerable timer.

This is a nice, really nice radio, guys. Solid, quality, and high-end feel. And, programming is really easy as it follows the 9303 programming philosophy.

- John

Protos -- Logo 14 -- Logo 10
03-21-2008 07:04 PM
 
 
Four Stroker
Veteran
Location: Atlanta

If you can pick where the points are and use the smoothing thing (EXP on JR ?), 8 points should be enough. I never use more than 7 points on the 12Z Spline curves anyway.
03-21-2008 09:54 PM
 
 
JKos
Elite Veteran
Location: Town of California in the state of Maryland

> If you can pick where the points are and use the smoothing thing
> (EXP on JR ?),

Yes, it has curve smoothing.

- John

Protos -- Logo 14 -- Logo 10
03-21-2008 10:04 PM
 
 
THX1138
Elite Veteran
Location: Plainfield, IN

Man, that is sweet, sweet!! I can't wait to get mine. Are "they" still saying May for release?

Lou

Back off man, I'm a scientist.
03-21-2008 10:24 PM
 
 
Dr.Ben
Elite Veteran
Location: Richmond, VA, USA

Yes and no RE the duplication of the linkage compensation mixers with conventional mixers.......

For the straight swash leveling stuff that occurs on page one or the left side of the MZ screen, you can emulate those mixers with pmixers. Ail>Ele and Ele>Ail mixers are "canned" swash phase mixers.

The linkage compensation mixers cannot be easily duplicated with free mixers because they selectively move only certain servos within the triad. The linkage compensation mixers work by taking the servo that is underthrowing the linkage as a result of differential travel and moving that servo farther than the mirror image servo driving the other side of the swash (speaking here as an example of a ail>pit interaction mixer). You can't pick out a servo within the two that control the roll axis on an eCCPM model and tell only that servo what to do with a conventional function to function pmixer. If JR's software doesn't do this, then someone is going to have to explain to me/us in detail exactly how you precisely control the effects of differential servo travel as they relate to swash interactions and do so independently on both ends of the collective range.

With the Futaba eCCPM software and assuming high quality, well matached servos, you can effectively nullify ALL interactions in an eCCPM model. I mean you can keep the swash uniball and paddles essentially as quiet as they would be in an mCCPM model. Can this be done with JR's software? Can this be done with JR's software without having to use extra free mixers in addtion the the eCCPM software menu? How many screens do you have to hop around in to get it all dialed in?

John..........is it confirmed that the software in the 12X is not upgradeable ?

Ben Minor
03-22-2008 01:22 AM
 
 
JKos
Elite Veteran
Location: Town of California in the state of Maryland

Ben,
Futaba does not have what JR calls "Swash Expo" which cancels out the differential servo throws that cause things like aileron to collective interaction away from zero collective. It seems to me that this is what the extra mixes on the 12Z and 14MZ end up accomplishing (and is exactly how you just described it) although admittedly in more finely adjustable method. It has been an on/off feature on the DX7 and 9303 radios but is now adjustable on the 12X.

> With the Futaba eCCPM software and assuming high quality, well
> matached servos, you can effectively nullify ALL interactions in
> an eCCPM model.

Hmm, I must be doing something wrong because I could achieve that years ago with a Stylus before the 14MZ existed. But it had the two adjustments that the 12X has now picked up and those two adjustments were the icing on the cake for that radio's CCPM setup. Given the excellent CCPM setups I was able to accomplish with the Stylus, I'm simply not convinced that it takes all the separate adjustments on the 12Z/14MZ to achieve it.

- John

Protos -- Logo 14 -- Logo 10
03-22-2008 02:40 AM
 
 
tgo
Senior Heliman
Location: HK

hi JKOS,

Does the 12X shown the software version like Futaba 12/14 series?

Thanks
TGO
03-22-2008 02:47 AM
 
 
JKos
Elite Veteran
Location: Town of California in the state of Maryland

TGO,
I don't know. Not something I looked for.

- John

Protos -- Logo 14 -- Logo 10
03-22-2008 02:49 AM
 
 
Slartybartfast
Senior Heliman
Location: Somewhere in England

JKos,

How much different is the one that you had a play with to the one that Mac_Man described, listed, advised, informed etc etc us about ?

His info is still up on the MacGregor site last time I looked.

http://www.macgregor.co.uk/radio/12X.htm
03-22-2008 12:07 PM
 
 
Dr.Ben
Elite Veteran
Location: Richmond, VA, USA

John,

I'd really like to see how the swash expo works with a radio in that I can actually play with. The deal with having the numbers independently adjustable comes into play for me when the servos start to loose match over time. It is in those cases that what applied on one side of the range doesn't always apply on the other, and the numbers I've used have never been matched for both sides of the adjustment range. In theory, too, the degree to which the adjustments apply to to all areas of the collective range is someone a function of how pure the eCCPM system is. Suffice it to say that some mfg's do this A LOT better than others.

I wish I were going to Toledo this year, because then I could see how the software works in person. If indeed it does accomplish the same tasks as the Futaba software does via another route, then good for JR and their customers.

Ben
03-22-2008 03:25 PM
 
 
JKos
Elite Veteran
Location: Town of California in the state of Maryland

Slartybartfast,
The differences I noticed pretty quick are 50 model memory versus Mac_Man's 20 and no mention of APCM (12 ch PCM).

- John

Protos -- Logo 14 -- Logo 10
03-23-2008 02:41 AM
 
 
ddavison
Veteran
Location: Brownsville, Pennsylvania

Was the one you looked at the module one or the dedicated 2.4 version ? Any word on available date ?

DaveDavison, Miniature Aircraft Field Rep.
03-23-2008 02:56 AM
 
 
OICU812
rrProfessor
Location: World Resources Capitol, Canada

Nice John, I know if you like it I will like it as well, thanks for the hands on report.

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...
03-25-2008 06:43 AM
 
 
THX1138
Elite Veteran
Location: Plainfield, IN

I am loving all this info!! That means it is getting close. I can't frigging wait for mine! 1 month left in the sand box boys! Then it is home to my family and new heli heaven!

Lou

Back off man, I'm a scientist.
03-25-2008 10:34 AM
 
 
fredd
Senior Heliman
Location: UK - London

JKOS, do you know if you can do swashplate phasing in the 12X (with graupner you just dial-in rotation in degrees).
03-25-2008 02:03 PM
 
 
seattle_helo
Key Veteran
Location: Washington State, USA

John, thanks for that info!
03-30-2008 10:07 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
seattle_helo
Key Veteran
Location: Washington State, USA

FYI, pictures and more info regarding the R1221 and R1222 receivers are now on the Horizon website. They look fantastic.

nick
04-01-2008 06:20 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
dhollein
Key Veteran
Location: Tucson, AZ

Hmmm... I'd love to have one of those....But I don't have a money tree in my backyard...
04-01-2008 07:42 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Qrrambero
Veteran
Location: San Francisco / Bay Area

Here is a money tree for you.
This will help you to buy the JR 12X



Ae
04-02-2008 04:45 AM
 
 
Dakine
Elite Veteran
Location: OC, Commifornia

12X, is it available yet? I'd like to get one ASAP.

Thank you

Tony Rawlings, What good is 911...cops can't be everywhere...use 1911.
04-02-2008 05:13 AM
 
 
11 pages [ <<    <     7      8     ( 9 )     10      11     NEXT    >> ]10757 viewsPOST REPLY
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Radio - Servo - Gyro - Gov - Batt > JR 12x Update... release date info... sorta
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