RunRyder - Dominator 20 review

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QuickWorldWide Ep and Wet Fuel Helis > Dominator 20 review

RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

Hi guy's;

I have Dominator 20. I found some situations, but I will want to share a general review and recommendation with all of you, also I will post some "personal" settings and parts that I made.

I'm NOT WORK for HHI or received any benefit. I'm BSME with more than 20 years in the hobby and rep for other RC heli trade; also I have expertise in manufacturing and last assembly techniques. Just I want to use my experience with QWW in your benefit because I LOVE THIS HOBBY!.

I don't follow any related sequence for posting information. As soon I have pictures and "time" to write, I will continue add "info" in this posting. I will identify each Dom20 review sections by "NOTE" numbers#;

NOTE#1: 1/9/08
Zenoah 20 and pull starter installation

The Zenoah 20 comes in airplane prop format from factory, so you need to remove the front prop-hub from the motor (if need help for that PM). After that, the electronic ignition magnet position is VERY important and only need to follow the manual instruction for the correct angle position. I don't used governor in my model so I don't install magnet in the fan. For ignition sensor base its necessary used more washers 4/2 in one of the two screws. Verify the fan covers that not have extra tension caused by warping. Fan shroud installation can be showed in the Big Dominator manual. It’s possible that need screw holes elongation and washers in the screws to correct align of the cover.

To install the standard market pull start its necessary small grinding in the plastic base (I will include picture later) to fit in the aluminum bottom motor base. The pull starter main motor shaft of ZH20 is short compared with other big size motors and the market standard pull starter nut need to used extra lock washer to find the necessary height.

I made the nut and tool set to fix this. Tool its necessary to simplify the installation and not cause damage in the nut, damage in the nut will affect the motor rotation and generate vibrations. Add lock washers and Locktite before install the nut.

At this moment I install the pull starter directly using the same screws that hold the bottom motor crank base (as per manual) and NOT have any issues. Just use medium locktite on them. DO NOT over tight the six suspended screws motor base, isn’t necessary if you used red locktite. The motor alignment should be good if you can free rotate the clutch bell by hand and the gears align correctly.

Possibles "issues" - Pull starter wire touch the frame and motor base edges and this cause damage.

TO BE CONTINUE:

RGRDS

WWW.HELIENGINEERNING.COM

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01-09-2008 08:06 PM

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rsalazar
Key Veteran
Location: Florida, USA

Thanks for the review and keeps updating us on the progress

01-10-2008 02:55 PM

RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

Note#2 1/10/08

Thanks rsalazar for your words, this motivates me to continue.

NOTE#2 1/10/08

ZH20 motor installation,

The motor installation design is very good, because have easy access for remove and installation, also the main motor 6 screws mount are suspended in rubber bushings/spacers that practically eliminate most of the engine vibration.

The instruction manual show using the 3 FHCS screws to hold the motor (used in biggest motor), but for the ZH20 it’s necessary to used the 4 holes and screws of the pull starter. I remove AL base that come in the motor (to fit the correct model stack height assy) used on airplane format. Before install the motor on the base with the 4 screws of the pull-starter its necessary made changes mentioned above in NOTE#1. Drill thru the Heli motor base (pull-starter location) holes 4X (for M4) to eliminate the thread, this ensure the correct stack position. Remember that motor will used the pull-starter like a big plastic washer, is important that NOT OVER TIGHT and used metal washer in each screw. Also, in my kit I need to increase the side frame motor suspension base holes 6x to pass thru for M4 screws.

Parts and tool necessary not included in the kit:

**11/64 drill bit for thru M4

**pull-starter

**pull starter nut (custom for Dominator 20 and showed in Note#1)

RGRDS

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01-10-2008 08:19 PM

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RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

Note#3 1/11/08

Note#3 1/11/08 REAR PRO METAL BELT TRANSMISSION

This is one of the best rear transmissions that I ever used.
The Pro metal rear transmission not included instruction, manual show different assembly.

This was my findings;
1. be careful at install the inside screws for the linkage base, tiny screw high-torque.
2. Need to balance the quantity of washer used between belt gears (both sides) to avoid axial movement. When install both principal side walls the shaft and gear can move freely, but without axial movement. Ups!!! Remember install the belt before closed the transmission walls..

3. The AL spacer used on each side of the belt tension pulleys needs to be grinded for correct fit inside transmission. CAREFUL; NOT GRIND TOO MUCH.
4. I remove the blades grips and lubricate the trust bearing.
5. I change the yoke ball link screws by harder ones. (Not in the picture)
6. Verify the yoke that not have axial movement, if possible need adjustment.
7. In the linkage its necessary add extra washers to avoid hit the bottom of the transmission. Do not add too much or will have issues with the yoke ball link. I recommend half or more ball area inside of linkage hole. Also I add locknut in the top of the screw to avoid high screw torque and add safety.
8. factory rear transmission shaft not include safety hole for blade grip hub set screw, so I made small grind in the shaft for safety anti torque.
9. When install the transmission push the boom completely inside the transmission. Adjust the belt tension in the frame, not in the transmission.
10. I made small hole and tap (picture) in opposite vertical fin side to install transmission anti rotation screw.

Note: In the picture shows the rear blades black spacers outside of the grips, but should be inside. Also its little heavy, but Im designing some DIET modifications.

RGRDS

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01-12-2008 03:30 AM

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RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

NOTE #4

General main frame assembly 1/16/08

Actually all top of the market models include CF or G10 frames, Modular sections, minimum plastic parts, aluminum structural high tension parts and CCPM mechanism; founded in DOMINATOR QWW. This model included in the basic kit many of the upgrades not included in other brands. I only add the PRO rear transmission, Finish screws caps and the Zimmerman pipe to my kit.

The manual comes in CD format(CD included information of all QWW models) and its necessary print out for assembly reference. Manual used direct 3D drawings to show the sequence and assembly procedure. In each page included BOM (Bill of material) for this assembly step. I recommend verify in the next steps or assembly instructions to clarify doubt's. Due to metal-metal assembly (screws to AL) maintain your medium locktite close to you all the time.

Just verify these minor observations (identify in the manual instructions in BLUE COLOR words) and all the assembly will be straight forward.

Next: top cyclic and collective assembly

regards,

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01-15-2008 07:52 PM

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rsalazar
Key Veteran
Location: Florida, USA

how are you doing with the heli?

Any more updates!!

01-18-2008 10:12 PM

RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

my DOM20 is Used for....

My DOM20 its practically in breaking, but I bought for Aerial Photography ( www.camaraaerea.com ) purpose and some fun when I want. Actually is grounded because I have carburetor diaphragm issues. I will continue with my inputs soon. All my post are experiences during assembly process and I write when I remember something that I guess can help other in the same process.

regards,

Julio

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01-21-2008 06:11 PM

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rsalazar
Key Veteran
Location: Florida, USA

Thanks Julio for the update

01-21-2008 08:11 PM

RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

This is part of the reallity in my QWW Dominator 20 NEW kit

I will try to remember all... my memories of the BAD experience during assembly my Dominator 20.

Wrong or bad parts from QWW in Dominator 20 kit:

1. swashplate DON'T have the threaded holes to sustain the main bearing ball assembly - they said that just add JB weld...

first crash...
2. incorrect boom (too long), but the manual don't mention anything about correct length.
3. incorrect tail transmission - wrong boom diameter 21mm
4. BAD belt (light brown color belt lock inside the boom) replaced by black one as per request.
5. Clutch bell and motor gear broken
6. two different rear blade grips

I will continue later...

what about a $14.95 just for the two landing skids AL tubes...

these parts was replaced, but I need to pay for the return of the incorrect parts. remember that I found each situation at a time and thinking how many time I lost assembly this model (without count the time fighting with QWW to convince of their errors).

Yes!
people from QWW replace many of them, But anyone want this situation in a NEW $1000++ kit?

Irwin have 21 years of experience in this area and Clark is a real scale expert, I hope can identify all these situations and used all customer inputs to continue in the business. But QWW needs more than Shuttle and other staff fighting with the clients or potential clients.

I'm patience with QWW and try to be quiet, but I'm feel really bad when do the same on many other clients.

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01-25-2008 12:51 PM

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Quick Worldwide
rrAdvertiser
Location: Coopersburg, PA

Amazing!!

Raptor, I will not argue that there was a mix up in the packing of your kit. However I will strongly argue the statement you make about customer service. We immediately sent you the parts to correct the issue. We even gave you parts at discount when you first crashed due to a build error that had nothing to do with us. I personally called you to resolve any problems you had with any part of the kit. Myself and others here have worked hard to revamp our packing/shipping, and especially our customer service. I personally find it insultive that after all the help and support you were given, you would go on here and say otherwise. If you care to discuss this issue in person you can email chris@quickworldwide.com and I will be more than happy to hear any legit issues with our service to you. Also, there is no place in the instructions, nor would anyone here instruct you to use JB weld to hold the main bearing assembly in. Even so, we still gave you parts at discount to repair your heli after an accident that occured because you didn't follow instructions. When you put the bottom main gear in upside down, we still worked with you to correct the problem. I by no means claim we are perfect, but it would be appreciated if we were criticized on issues that are actually our fault, which I admit the wrong parts in the kit is our fault. However wrong assembly is beyond our control, if something wasn't clear enough in the instructions we can easily be reached via this forum, email, phone, fax, etc. We are not hard to contact. We have sold hundreds of these kits to people that built them with no problems with parts or instructions. I can only assume they are out enjoying their heli and don't take the time to post on the forum. Besides, not every pilot in the world goes to runryder.

Our goal is good customer service, and to make a quality machine. If there is a problem we are here to help. While no company is perfect we are working hard to work out the bugs to be as close to perfect as possible.

Chris

01-25-2008 03:27 PM

RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

Part of the assembly experience

See the picture included; "refresh your mind with the JB recommendation"

Don't take my words personal. Are facts and I share them with many of US - YOUR CLIENTS.
Something are wrong and ever point your finger to us.

I'm trying to mention and share with all the people the good characteristics in the Dominator 20, but I can't agree how you (staff) manage all the Quality issues and I can't be quiet.

People: its true that QWW try to resolve my issue, but ever were my fault...

just think; Any of us "your client" want to have "situation or issues" with our next new model???

If you know about marketing should be recognize what its
THE POWER OF MOUTH and need more attention on that.

I have others documents if you want more "mind refreshment". Remember that us (many of your clients) just forget and continues flying other model.

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01-25-2008 04:19 PM

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Quick Worldwide
rrAdvertiser
Location: Coopersburg, PA

First off, I only blamed you for the main gear being upside down, which broke the clutch bell, and the JB welded head. I have read over the many emails between you and Jon (which were all written professionally and were the very definition of customer service), and I see he offered to help you every way possible. As for the JB Weld, the mention of that and the lock-tite was to help hold in the screws, which is needed for all metal to metal connections. Although my college degree is not in engineering and I am not a heli expert, I can't see how someone would think that the correct solution was to basically glue the swashplate assembly together. Even if that is how you interpret what was said in the email, common sense should kick in and say that gluing the swash together isn't right. As for accepting blame, like I said before I have no problem accepting blame that the kit was not properly packed. This is a problem that is solved. I can appreciate that you want to share experiences with others, but coming at us like this after all the help you were given doesn't come across to me as helpful criticism.

As for power of mouth, I totally agree. Unfortunately the 99% of people who have bought and built this kit with no problem have no reason to post on a forum. If they do they are "QWW boys", or some of the other colorful terms used to describe our satisfied customers. So why should they post? Since this is the case, the 1% who have a problem will always have the loudest voice. Like I said previously, if you have suggestions or constructive criticism I am glad to take it as advice.

Chris

01-25-2008 05:13 PM

RaptorEngineer
Heliman
Location: Aguadilla, Puerto Rico

Good opportunity for QWW fanatics

I will sell my Dominator 20 with motor/pipe and MAH CF blades. If youre interested please PM me, will save more than $500 of my original price and just have 6 flights.

thanks for looking

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01-30-2008 12:32 AM

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QuickWorldWide Ep and Wet Fuel Helis > Dominator 20 review

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