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JR-Spektrum . Gyro Hobbies . E-flite

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Align T-REX 600N 700N > Got the shakes!
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Ive had a few engine issues over the past few weekends so haven't noticed any problems until today when I got the engine sorted. The heli has quite an intense vibration at anywhere between 1600 and 2000rpm. The canopy vibrates a lot and this is throwing the gyro off a bit.
Anyway I got it home today and pulled down the head to see if I could find the problem. I checked the main shaft and it was straight. Pulled out the spindle and low and behold I had two IN thrust washers on one side and two OUT washers on the other side. Not exactly sure how this happened as I was pretty meticulous about this when putting the kit together... oh well.
So I haven't had a chance to test it out and wont until next weekend. Does anyone know if this would have been causing the vibe, or should I continue looking?

Cheers

Fil
07-29-2007 Over year old.
 
 
altima1779
Senior Heliman
Location: Toledo, oh u.s

I would think if the head is unbalanced it could cause a vibration for sure, doesn't take much.

You have to start somewhere!
07-29-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Ozydego
Key Veteran
Location: Westerville, Ohio

I would think the bearings not functioning might cause the vibe, but more just not good response from the heli.... I would look further just in case... one mistake could mean a second somewhere else....

But Honey, I can't live with just stock.....
07-29-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Well I spooled it up this morning (im sure my neighbors appreciated that!) and it still vibrates. So I pulled out the engine again and noticed that the clutch can be wiggled sideways. Is this normal? I cant see how you can stop it occuring as there is only one bearing really holding the clutch bell in a plastic housing??
Also, one arm of my clutch is slightly more raised than the other. Could this be an issue?

Any help would be much appreciated. Its deffinitely a high speed vibe so I would think somewhere around the engine would be causing it??
07-30-2007 Over year old.
 
 
altima1779
Senior Heliman
Location: Toledo, oh u.s

Are your blades balanced? Does the clutch shoe move? or are you talking about the clutch bell having side to side play. So many things to look at. I would start with one item and work my way through until it is good.

You could check the following.

Tail output shaft.
Main shaft
feathering shaft.
blade balance.
Tail blades too tight, too lose. Same for main blades.
Was the fan and engine dial indicated?

You have to start somewhere!
07-30-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Ive checked most of those things and everything seems OK. How are you meant to do anything about it if you dial indicated the fan/motor. Theres no room for adjustment
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
altima1779
Senior Heliman
Location: Toledo, oh u.s

The fan and hub i use a prop balancer and remove material from the heavy side by drill into fan a little but not all the way through.

With the engine fan and clutch shoe attached we put the engine in a vise and dial indicate, when i find a low spot on the shaft i gently bend it up. We used the chuck end of a drill and lightly bend up.

I am sure there is a better way and maybe someone can jump in with suggestions.

You have to start somewhere!
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Are you saying you bend the motor crank shaft, or do you bend up the edge of the fan?
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
altima1779
Senior Heliman
Location: Toledo, oh u.s

no do not bend the motor crank shaft or the fan. First i would balance the fan and hub on a prop balancer. Then i would put everything back together except for the clutch bell. Put the motor in a vise with the hub, fan and clutch shoe attached. Us a dial indicator on the end of the clutch shoe shaft and check to so how far it is out. Start at zero and slowly turn the motor over with the dial indicator at the end of the the clutch shoe shaft. Most say it should be as close to 1 thousands out. If it is more when you find the low spot that is out you can gently bend the clutch shoe shaft to straighten it. Check again and see if the shaft is strait.

You have to start somewhere!
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

OK. But the clutch shoe on a 600N is mounted via two screws to the clutch hub so there is no shaft to bend. You could bend out the clutch shoe arms I guess... ?
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
altima1779
Senior Heliman
Location: Toledo, oh u.s

There is not shaft that attaches to the clutch shoe? No do not bend the clutch shoe arms, they will break the first time you run it.

You have to start somewhere!
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

No theres no shaft only a sold hub so theres no way you can adjust the clutch or fan runout on a 600N.
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
altima1779
Senior Heliman
Location: Toledo, oh u.s

Maybe if you ask in the Align T-REX 600N forum how to dial indicate the 600n they can help you out much more than i can.

You have to start somewhere!
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
drdot
Elite Veteran
Location: So. California, Orange County.

fwiw..

dial indicate the base of the clutch mount just under where the clutch mounts...Clutch is never round, and is defined by the clutch bell when it's engaged...Sounds like the head is out of balance...I'd suggest a DuBro or similar high point balancer...Balance the head complete without the blades, then balance the blades...Assembly will then be in decent static balance...

John.
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

How do you balance the head as there is no hole that goes all the way through to put the balancing spindle in?
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
ARMSMASTER
Veteran
Location: spokane, wa

Use a Dubro high point balancer. The instructions are on the back. You balance the head assembly much the same way as you would a prop spinner assembly. I know if you do a serch on RR you will find photo's of the process. Good luck. I have the same problem with my trex. I need to balance the head when I get a chance.

Caution or the Earth will Swallow you Up!
07-31-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Alright. I took the fan completely out of the equation and removed it. Still got vibration.

The following are things that I have checked:

Changed tail blades
Checked main shaft
Balanced head
Balanced main blades
Balanced fan/clutch assembly
Changed Dampers for softer ones
Changed fan over
Checked clutch bell
Adjusted needle settings on hyper
Rebuilt tail
Rebuilt head
Changed to a TT muffler
Took off fan completely
Changed glow plug
Played with mixture again

I can spool up at full headspeed on the ground and see the vibration occur. If I switch off the motor while the vibration is happening (easily seen in the fuel tank) the vibration continues to occur?????

If I take off the blades and spool up to full headspeed the heli is smooth as silk. Put the blades back on, vibrations occur..????

Also, it was noticed this afternoon that there is a very small amount of play in the main shaft. If you rock it backwards and forwards it moves slgihtly. Its obvioulsy play in the bearings that hold the shaft. Not sure if this is normal?
08-01-2007 Over year old.
 
 
SkaterX
Heliman
Location: Canada

I have all the same problems with mine as well (non pro with torque tube)... It spools smooth without blades, but under load it shakes...

On top of your list, ive changed swash servos, new engine, balanced and weighed every piece that spins, different main blades, different tail blades, different paddles, metal blade grips, metal seesaw, one way bearing twice, torque tubes, tail shaft, spindle head, spindle shaft, main shaft...

I have a short list left, hopefully I can catch it before It makes me build my parts kit...
1. replace bearings on main shaft.
2. replace tail drive gear assembly.
3. replace clutch and clutchbell.
08-02-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Filby
Heliman
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Arghhhhh!

You are way futher along the dreaded list of replacement parts than I am! The one thing we have in common is our main shaft bearings may need replacing! Please keep me informed if you find out the problem.
08-02-2007 Over year old.
 
 
MJHiscott92504
Veteran
Location: James Hiscott #6 Carter Place Monroe WA 98272 USA

Balance

Did you balance the clutch and fan assembly ?

Owner of MJHeli Products
08-02-2007 Over year old.
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Align T-REX 600N 700N > Got the shakes!
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