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e-Electric Batteries & Chargers > Anyone Heard of these new Lipos Update # 4 Video Added
 
 
Corona44
Senior Heliman
Location: Sydney,NSW Australia

Well after the wild storms of the last 2 odd weeks here in Sydney the weather was fine though cold yesterday so with batteries charged the Trex and my new Multiplex Funjet (gotta have something to build when the weather is crap) headed out to my favourite flying field south west of Sydney.

Installed a Air Thunder in the Rex and took off for some fun flying.

First couple of full power vertical climbs while ok didn't seem anything special and puzzled about this for a while, then the old grey matter started computing and I realized it was the ambient temperature which was around 12deg C, that's pretty cold for Sydney.

After about 1 minute the packs had warmed up I guess and things are getting seriously fun, vertical collective stick pumping produces great response and I continue to be amazed at just how well a Futaba 401 gyro works to deal with such sudden and brutal forces and using only a 65MG servo!

I continued to fly the pack until my Quark 33A hits the low voltage point which is signalled by it causing a "misfire" like throttle response, this was at about 200ft up, dropped the collective and commenced a Auto towards the ground, by the time it was down to about 20 feet I raised collective again and as expected the Quark gave me normal power again and I continued to fly around and hover until low voltage caused the Quark to say enough is enough and landed (well was actually forced down by the Quark stopping the motor altogether)

Flight time was a tad over 12 minutes with about 7 minutes of hard collective movements and the rest easy flying.

A second Airthunder as installed in the Funjet which is running a 450TH motor and 5.25 x 5 prop, this pulls 35 amps full throttle and is so fast I can't fly the thing myself at those speeds so I let a mate fly it who is a much more experience fixed wing pilot. Again the Air Thunder worked very well producing unlimited rolling verical climbs till the aircraft is a speck in the sky which is around 1500 ft.

The Funjet was flown until the Align 25A ESC could be heard pulsing the motor then landed. Now this is a "foam" airframe which is a good thermal insulator for the battery which as expected was hot but with no signs of swelling or distress.

Both these batteries were balance charged last night when I got home and both have taken around 2250 & 2380mAH back in, so I think it's fare to say I used them till they were basically "flat"

I have purchased a eFlight datalogger but forgot to pack it in my parts box so I don't have any hard inflight data to share at this time.

So far I think it's fare to say I am very happy so far, I am looking for batteries that I can "just fly" without needing to run a stopwatch on to prevent damage and puffing. In the Trex its easy to feel when the cells are past their best power and then one can choose to land and change battery or keep "easy flying" and enjoy the extra flight time without having to worry that the cells will be permanently damaged.

I don't have any intention of deliberatly abusing them but if I buy a 2200mAH pack I want to get roughly that much out of it. So many of you are flying 2100 or 2200 packs and stop flying after 4,5 or 6 minutes and only putting back 1200-1300mA, that's to short for me and not what I had in mind when I started this Heli stuff last year.

A mate and I have just placed orders for a pair of Hurricane 550 Pro helis which are just coming onto the Australian market next month.

Choose this heli over the 600 Rex because it uses 2 Trex 450 size packs in series, ie 2200mAH in a 6S1P config and I think the Air Thunders will work really well in this much bigger bird.

Flying, crashing & having a ball.
06-24-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Corona44
Senior Heliman
Location: Sydney,NSW Australia

Follow up to my last post on yesterdays flying, My mate who also flys a Trex 450 and who is also waiting on a Hurricane 550 tells me he has just placed an order with Air Thunder for 4 packs after seeing how well mine performed yesterday.

It should be pointed out that these packs are slightly larger and a little heavier than most others out there and for some that may be a negative if weight or size is critical.

Flying, crashing & having a ball.
06-24-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Wingman77
Key Veteran
Location: Pulaski TN US

ny heli is tail heavy so a lillte more weight wont be so bad
06-24-2007 Over year old.
 
 
nojohnny101
Elite Veteran
Location: 10 miles north of Cincy, OHIO

hey
wow..that took a long time..reading 12 pages!!

looks good fellas....i'll be picking up packs soon.....


how's it going Air-Alpheus? what' the latest???





Thanks
~Will-i-am~
06-26-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Air_Alpheus
Veteran
Location: Trafford,PA - USA

65 Cycles and still going strong. I will post the 75th cycle results when I get there...

Its What I dont Say You Should Be Worried About...
Bruce A Aunkst III
Team AirThunder
06-26-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
OUCaptain
Senior Heliman
Location: Heli Addict Rehab Center

I recieved an e-mail from air thunder today. The 6S packs will hopefully be available mid-july. I hope so. I'm down to my last unpuffed pack for my Rex600.

"Human beings are viruses with shoes"
06-26-2007 Over year old.
 
 
nojohnny101
Elite Veteran
Location: 10 miles north of Cincy, OHIO

hey
just have a quick question...

i have an accucyle elite which doesn't have a balancer and can't work in conjuction with a balancer....


is there a balancer that i can buy or how would i go about charging these batteries...i want to avoid splicing and such...i can do soldering but just want all the connections to work


thanks for your time!



Thanks
~Will-i-am~
06-26-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Dennisu
Veteran
Location: Surrey, B.C. Canada

nojohnny101

There are a couple of balancers that go in between the charger and the battery and "link" the two together to make a "balance charger". I use a v-balance from Flight Power and they give you the adapters to fit most of the new batteries and you can get adapters for all the old style balance plugs if you need them
06-26-2007 Over year old.
 
 
pcliftonjr
Key Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Balancer...

I use a TP-205; they sell an adapter cable for $4. No soldering/splicing required.

Paul
06-26-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Powrplay
Senior Heliman
Location: Vacaville, Ca

Not to familiar with the accucycle, however the "Astro Blinky" or the "Common Sense" balancer will fit.

Personally, I highly recommend the FMA CellPro. You'll need to purchase the adapters for them.

Adapters:

For the AT 4s pack = CP-TP/PQ

For the AT 2S and 3s = CP-GP

If there is another or better brand out there, GREAT! This is what I'm using and so far it is flawless! This is just my personal opinion. Buy what you want

Errol
06-26-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
nojohnny101
Elite Veteran
Location: 10 miles north of Cincy, OHIO

hey
so if i just get a balancer that goes inbetween the charger and the battery then i can only "balance charge" one battery at a time?

i would like to be able to utalize my charger's ability to charge two lipos at the same time!




Thanks
~Will-i-am~
06-26-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
SSN Pru
Elite Veteran
Location: Massachusetts

then you need to get 2 balancers ideally...


Its not absolutely required to balance charge your packs every charge unless they are known to go out of balance on every charge in which case the pack is questionable in quality anyhow.

A balance on every other charge should suffice if you dont want to get two balancers.


I know that air thunder recommends that you balance charge on every charge but i havent found that to be the case unless you are charging at something over 1C.

EDIT: THIS IS ASSUMING THAT YOU HAVE DISCHARGED YOUR PACK DOWN TO 80% AND HAVE NOT EXCEEDED THE PACKS MAXIMUM CONTINUOUS DISCHARGE RATING.

If you avoid failure, you also avoid success.
06-26-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Dennisu
Veteran
Location: Surrey, B.C. Canada

umdpru

Sorry but I have to dissagree with you about balancing everytime. All it takes is a heavy discharge to really upset the balance on the battery and that next charge is going to send one or more cells over the top on charging because a full battery charger is only going to stop when the battery voltage reaches full charge voltage. At that point some cells may be overcharged and some under charged. Best to do it everytime. It only take a few more minutes to do it right.
06-26-2007 Over year old.
 
 
MrMel
Elite Veteran
Location: Lidingo, Sweden

With Airthunder its even more important to balance then regular lipos, since you pull them down so low, there will be great imbalance every discharge (volt wise) since there is so little capacity below 2.9v.
06-26-2007 Over year old.
 
 
SSN Pru
Elite Veteran
Location: Massachusetts

Quote 
Sorry but I have to dissagree with you about balancing everytime. All it takes is a heavy discharge to really upset the balance on the battery and that next charge is going to send one or more cells over the top on charging because a full battery charger is only going to stop when the battery voltage reaches full charge voltage. At that point some cells may be overcharged and some under charged. Best to do it everytime. It only take a few more minutes to do it right.

I know the intricacies of lipo charging and how to do it safely without damaging a battery pack but i thank you for clearing that up for anyone that i may have confused. I was not clear about that in my previous post. I'll edit it.

It is not neccessary to balance a lipo pack on every charge assuming that the discharge was carried out in accordance with acceptable practices meaning not discharging higher than C rating and not going below 80%.

Following those discharge parameters then you should not have to charge your pack every charge. Ive personally gone dozens of flights with a tp 2100 prolite and not had to balance it. I still balance that pack every charge because i only own 1 balancer and a charger that is capable of charging 1 pack at a time. I figure why not cover my arse.

I was merely stating the fact that it is not required under normal operating condidtions.

Overdischarging does not count as normal operating conditions and thus requires more care when charging which requires balancing.

I was not clear about that in my previous post.

Since airthunder has "developed" these packs so that they are safely over-discharged then it follows that they should be carefully balanced each and every charge when they are discharged in that manner. I would wager some money on the fact that if they were drawn down 80% while discharging below thier C rating, you wont have to balance them every charge.

If you avoid failure, you also avoid success.
06-26-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Dennisu
Veteran
Location: Surrey, B.C. Canada

umdpru

The reason I posted was to prevent new lipo users from getting off on the wrong foot and not balancing every time. If we, as long time users of Lipo's, start telling people that balancing is not necessary then I feel we are doing them a disservice. I have found that 100 people can tell someone how it is supposed to be done and then one person says the opposite and that is the one they listen to. Just my two cents.
06-27-2007 Over year old.
 
 
SSN Pru
Elite Veteran
Location: Massachusetts

Quote 
If we, as long time users of Lipo's, start telling people that balancing is not necessary then I feel we are doing them a disservice.

I would like you to point out to me where i said to "never balance your lipos".

Please dont put words in my mouth. I never said that. This is what I said:

Quote 
A balance on every other charge should suffice if you dont want to get two balancers.

If you avoid failure, you also avoid success.
06-27-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Dennisu
Veteran
Location: Surrey, B.C. Canada

umdpru

I didn't say that you said "never balance your lipo's" but I was trying to make the point that it is better to tell people to balance every time instead of saying it's o.k. to do it every second time because when the time they do that it catches fire, because of an imbalance, and they say "well they said to do it every other charge and this wasn't the time I was supposed to balance them"

I repeat.
Quote 
I have found that 100 people can tell someone how it is supposed to be done and then one person says the opposite and that is the one they listen to.
06-27-2007 Over year old.
 
 
SSN Pru
Elite Veteran
Location: Massachusetts

I'm going to repeat what I said regardless of what you think,

It is not necessary to balance every charge if you are not abusing your packs. This does not mean to never balance your packs. This means that every other charge, you should balance your packs!

Done!

Your opinion is duly noted and I hope that a nub reading this thread understands what both of our sides are...

If you avoid failure, you also avoid success.
06-27-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Wingman77
Key Veteran
Location: Pulaski TN US

I dont even have a balancer. I borow a balancer when I go to the field so I balance my batteries about every 40 cycles. when I do put them on a balancer though they have been done in around 5min so I dont think that batteries really need to be balanced that often.
06-27-2007 Over year old.
 
 
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e-Electric Batteries & Chargers > Anyone Heard of these new Lipos Update # 4 Video Added
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