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Esprit Model . Thunder Power RC . Real Raptors

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e-E-Flite Blade CP CX 400-3D > Brushless DD Tail w/ GY401 - Sweet! (Video)
 
 
jefkawst
Heliman
Location: Carlsbad, CA - USA

TB9 ESC TAIL

Quote 
I only assigned a rudder-to-rudder mix to the throttle-hold switch to initiate the tail ESC after my GY401 initiates and to prevent the HH gyro from running the tail motor when I don't want it to -

I don't know what to tell you about your Telebee gyro except that I didn't like the behavior of my G90 on the bench either which is why I went with my GY401 instead - I liked the G90 fine with a brushed tail but not a brushless - I don't know what the difference is and didn't persue finding out after trying my GY401.

Micro-maniac,

Can you pleas elaborate more on "a rudder-to-rudder mix" with your throttle hold to arm your TB9 ESC. I went the TB9 ESC route to drive my BL tail, but to arm it I always had to hold full left during turning on/off the heli, taking off, and landing. I thought it was a pain and I couldn't take it so I went with a CC10, and with the right programming It was able to arm without holding full left.

So, just curious how you did yours. If you can please find the time to share.

Thanks,

Jeff
05-02-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

Here's the mix with my DX7 -

[PROG.MIX2]
RUDD-> RUDD
RATE: +75%
SW:HOLD
OFFSET: -125

All this does is moves the rudder position from neutral to 100% left so I don't have to move and hold the stick to the left myself to arm or disable the tail motor - It just disables the tail along with the main motor with throttle-hold -

Using my GY401 I leave throttle hold off and power the heli and wait for the gyro to establish a center then I switch throttle-hold on to arm the tail ESC - Then switch throttle-hold back off and fly - After I land or the heli is about to crash I hit throttle-hold and both motors are disabled.
 
05-02-2007 Over year old.
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

I added a pic of the component layout to my first post

But HeliHobby has some nicer photos and schematics of separate setups

http://www.helihobby.com/html/separate_electronics.html
05-19-2007 07:56 PM
 
 
pox67
Heliman
Location: Toronto, Canada

Awesome thread, been hunting for something like this for days!

If I can ask for a quick bit of advice, not looking to hijack the thread:
I am new to helis but have been training on a sim. My LHS carries E-Flite Blades so I have decided to go with one of them for sake of spares and getting help there.

I was going to get the Blade CP ARF which is just the frame and brushed motors.

I already have a DX6 and 2 spare CC PHX 10 ESCs (plenty of 3S batts as well) lying around so would you recommend this brushless setup to a beginner?

I am a tinkerer and like doing things properly, burned out tail motors would annoy me. The other option is to stick with the brushed motors and get an E-Flite 2-in-1 mixer.

I will need a gyro anyway, Micro-Maniac you said you had problems with the G90 and the GY401 was better. Do you think a GY240 would work out?

Thanks for any advice you can give
06-02-2007 03:14 AM
 
 
gmcullan
Veteran
Location: Southbridge, MA

The 10A ESC would be great for a BL DD tail. Many also use a 10A for a BL main. I prefer a higher capacity for the main BL motor, using a Sonix 18A ESC on three different airframes.

If you are into R/C helis for the long run or just want the most reliable and consistent performance, you can't gp wrong with brushless motors. My only regret is not going "brushless" sooner.

Gerry Cullan,
Blade CP, HoneyBee CP2, T-Rex 450 SE & SA, HDX300, MicroHeli Monster
06-02-2007 03:21 AM
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

Brushless is the way to go and building it brushless from ARF is the cheaper way to get it there

Any gyro will probably work and I've heard of success with the G90 and BL tail - My G90 just seemed odd on the bench and my 401 a little less odd so that's the one I test flew with which worked great - A 240 would probably work well also minus the digital servo mode of the 401 - Later I tested my G90 and it worked fine

A 10A ESC will definitely work on the tail and maybe a different main motor than what I'm running but for the park370 I'd recommend a bigger ESC
06-02-2007 05:08 AM
 
 
pox67
Heliman
Location: Toronto, Canada

Awesome, thanks gmcullen and Micro-Maniac. I have a CC PHX 25 in a plane that I could poach for a while.

Just one last question:
I also have the Century 4100kv motor that came with a Hummingbird 3D Pro, would this work out instead of the Park 370?
Could you recommend a pinion for it (currently has a 10t)?

If I was to go with a Park 370 which kv and pinion would be best for ok performance, I don't need to go ballistic (yet ?

After the motor is finalised I should be able to order up the parts. This has been a long process choosing a heli to suite me, thanks for your help.
06-02-2007 01:59 PM
 
 
gmcullan
Veteran
Location: Southbridge, MA

The HH gyro I'm using on my BL DD tails is the little Telebee 6g gyro. The sense lead is not pluged into the gear channel. That results in the gyro being locked into HH mode. Gyro gain is then set from the adjusting potentiometer on the gyro. About 50% seems to work just fine. For giggles and grins, I did set it to about 60% last evening. Ended up with a very nice tail wag so I reduced the gain back to 50%.

The BL DD tail works SO much better than the stock, brushed-motored geared tail.

Gerry Cullan,
Blade CP, HoneyBee CP2, T-Rex 450 SE & SA, HDX300, MicroHeli Monster
06-02-2007 02:13 PM
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

Your 4100kv motor should be perfect for the BCP - I'm running a park370/4100kv with 10t pinion myself - You can use an 8t 9t or 10t

8t = 2400rpm/140mph
9t = 2700rpm/160mph
10t = 3000rpm/180mph
06-02-2007 04:17 PM
 
 
pox67
Heliman
Location: Toronto, Canada

Awesome, thanks guys.

I am now ready to place my order
I am going to start a new thread with the rest of my newbie questions.
06-03-2007 02:40 PM
 
 
Ed1955
Senior Heliman
Location: Pocono Mountains, PA USA

Micro Maniac.....................

I may have missed it but could you please tell us the price of the components and where to purchase them?
Respectfully,
Ed
06-03-2007 02:52 PM
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

The list of components in my first post is hyperlinked - Click on a component and it'll take you to where I purchased it
06-03-2007 02:56 PM
 
 
s13flyboy
Heliman
Location: waco, tx

Micro-maniac,

I'm a newbie to the hobby so maybe I just don't know but, what do you mean you used a servo extension to hook up the tail motor? I saw the pics and the setup looks very clean, so I'd like to copy it. I just don't know how the servo extension works with the BL motor connectors. Did you get the servo extension from BPhobbies?

By the way I have a CP Pro with the park 370 BL main, e-flite esc, G90 gyro, and stock reciever.
06-04-2007 07:56 PM
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

I soldered servo style plugs on the motor and ESC so I could use a standard servo extension between them - Since those pics I've switched from a heavy-duty extension to one with thinner wires that I could feed through the boom
06-04-2007 08:56 PM
 
 
s13flyboy
Heliman
Location: waco, tx

Thanks micro-maniac! where did you get the new setup from? I'm trying to place an order at BP now, and I was hoping to only make one.
06-04-2007 09:00 PM
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

The servo wire I just picked up from the Local Hobby Store - The heavy-duty was Expert brand and the other was JR Sport
06-04-2007 09:00 PM
 
 
s13flyboy
Heliman
Location: waco, tx

thanks, my LHS really stucks as far as heli support. Who knows maybe they would actually have some wire laying around for those airplane guys!
06-04-2007 09:09 PM
 
 
zAmboni
Heliman
Location: Michigan, USA

Quote 
I soldered servo style plugs on the motor and ESC so I could use a standard servo extension between them - Since those pics I've switched from a heavy-duty extension to one with thinners wires that I could feed through the boom (requires cutting separating and soldering the extension - may as well fore-go the plugs)
I'm thinking of doing the same thing. I just moved my tail ESC to below the gyro on the back. Now I have a couple of extra inches of heavy wire wrapped up, and moving the ESC from the front it has made the heli quite tail heavy. Also would like to thread the new wire through the tail boom to make it look cleaner.
06-04-2007 09:16 PM
 
 
s13flyboy
Heliman
Location: waco, tx

Would there be any problems with overheating the smaller wire due to the how many amps are going thru them?
06-04-2007 09:19 PM
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

I don't think so - I haven't noticed any difference from the heavy-duty
06-04-2007 09:23 PM
 
 
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e-E-Flite Blade CP CX 400-3D > Brushless DD Tail w/ GY401 - Sweet! (Video)
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