rrTV-PHOTO   New HD TV
HOME   rrTV-PHOTO   GALLERIES   MY GALLERY   HELP-FAQ
myHOME PM pmRR MEMBERS 783 ONLINE 19 EVENTS SEARCH REGISTER  START HERE
 
3 pages [ <<    <     1     ( 2 )     3     NEXT    >> ]1158 viewsPOST REPLY
Autography FlightPower . Advantage Hobby . Revolution Models

.
.
Synergy R/C Synergy N9 > Tail Rotor blade Grips Play
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

Hans

I didn't derail the topic i asked a question to cricket publicly as he stated he was slop free.

But hey carry on what do i know i'm flying mine with no play ANYWHERE
and its a great heli, but slack in a system on any 90 size heli is asking for trouble.
Anyone saying it is acceptable should keep their opinions to themselves.

And for your information yes i must be a better pilot than those that you mentioned because i can feel the difference after i took the slop out of all the circuits, however i know i'm not....yet.

Anyone who can't really ought to stick to a shuttle.

There are guys here dialling there fans and hubs to 1 thousandth of an inch and yet the have over 10 thou of play in a ball link.

Go figure

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
hansking12
Senior Heliman
Location: irvine, ca

spookyeng

you're welcome--hope you enjoy the heli as much as i do.

still waiting for a analysis from droid to support his statement. . .

droid, perhaps you can post a video of yourself flying with the newfound precision you speak of and we can all be the judge. we've all seen the synergy team fly their "sloppy, shuttle-like (as you put it)" machines on posted videos already.

daddieyacht--i was in nz earlier this year--what a beautiful country! i mainly stayed on the south island. man, you kiwis really use/fly those full size helis hard it seems. i was looking at the nelson aviation college to get more detailed education for my full size training.

hans
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
johnito
Heliman
Location: New Mexico

Droid's plated balls

Droid, please go apply N9 thin CA to your plated balls... and stop dumping on shuttles. They were (and remain today) fine, inexpensive little basic machines that served as successful trainers for nearly every pilot flying today (including many many newer pilots who tried to learn on the Rappy but found it too squirrelly unless it was massively bling-up with after-market parts).

Good pilots don't rubbish other blokes' equipment.

And wise beginners DO NOT train on very expensive top-end helis unless they have more money than sense.

So go replate your balls.

And leave the 20-year-old sweet little shuttle Alone. Were you even born when it hit the markets in 1985??

Jack
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
wore-out-pilot
Senior Heliman
Location: Louisville, Kentucky USA

This post is going,going,going, like that bunnie. I would hope someone from Synergy would chime in on this subject, if not go to the web site and find out for sure.

MAKE-IT-HOT They call me aka the hammer
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

This threads shagged then!

Jack....Yes i was born before that, 1974 to be exact. Don't fire in here and slate me thinking i'm some 14 year old computer pilot who can only use the internet when daddy ain't looking.

Raptors aren't squirrely! But its ok to slate the raptor but not the shuttle? But hey we could have had some z bends on this mc and it would have been tighter. But that is my opinion same as your opinion, the problem with forums is that nobody wants to hear the truth i'm not rubbishing the N9 or the shuttle it was a metaphor!


Hans.... you are obviously educated i don't have a doctorate in fluid mechanics, to be fair the only fluid near my mechanics was the watery glue! But in the short time i have been flying i know the difference between a tight tail and a sloppy tail, but like i said i don't care anymore mine is sorted. And as for the 0.5mm play i think if you actually measured you would find it far in excess of that. Your response would have been fine if it where a small electric model but this thing has a lot of horses going through it and a lot of demand on the tail, i don't think JK & TB designed built in exponential for the tail.

For those that want to improve their tail rotor turn the thrust races around and it'll be nice and tight, but then i'm using a gyro, some of you guys are probably that good you don't need them.

Dont turn this into a sh!t slinging match coz i got a good backhand!

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Stu.
Veteran
Location: Abrakebabra Kebab shop

Some people really cant see the issues wiht this heli. QC is variable at best it seems.

Mind you i think mine came out on a friday afternoon.

COLLLETS!!!! ARGH! Stripped Threads...NO threads. Oversized Threads! Malformed plastic parts etc

To be honest the shine has gone out it for me. So i suppose ill get the head links sorted now I spent so much time on the fan getting it right i havent even looked at them yet.(after playing with the fan to get it right 1 thou on outer..oh goody....then 10 thou out on the centre so the clutch was like a cam....could run my car engine off it)

Yes i have flown it, and yes it flies nice...it could fly betetr tho...first step head link lengths then it will hopefully fly better

Flame retardant shield on.

Stu
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

yeah stu, there is 2 types of setting ccpm up, there is the right way and there is break the dremel out way. stu went for the later. flies like my x400.

on the point of the topic, i have not got any float like is being desribed. i have side to side as per any tail and there is play in the link to the slider as others have said.

cheers

p.s stu, i'll give you a tenner for that POS and i'll have 3 synergys since you don't want it.


www.waterfoothelis.com
09-11-2006 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

I'll bung you my teflon suit when i'm finished with it.

I hate it that individuals take things personally here like they designed the bit your slagging off.

We're only trying to make it better for everyone.

The general concensus is that apparently not one manufacturers heli is good out the box so why all the back biting!

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
johnito
Heliman
Location: New Mexico

Droid says "For those that want to improve their tail rotor turn the thrust races around and it'll be nice and tight, but then i'm using a gyro, some of you guys are probably that good you don't need them".

Hmm.

Droid.. I suggest you do a little basic reading about loads in rotor heads. Focus on the dynamic stresses (consequent upon deviating motions within a gyroscopically loaded rotor) that require ALL rotor heads to flap on both axes. Do a search on "dual-axis flapping". Re-read the text until you understand and/or accept it.

Now consider: A tail rotor is small and necessarily simplified, but it is, AT BASE, a rotor head subject to all the same demands as the main rotor head... and rotating 6 to 10 times as fast.

Why on earth do you think the designers of almost all heli mains and tails supply or recommend assymetrical thrust washers and/or thrust bearings?

They do this to allow slop.. which permits dual-axis flapping.

Even the Shuttle (pore lil rubbished Plastic Fantastic Shuttle) instructions carefully explain HOW the thrust bearing component with the smaller ID hole is explained first in one case and second in another. The assymetry of thrust washer IDs is how the engineering designer achieved (and controlled) the dual-axis flapping, m'boy. Maybe yer moight loike ta nacht be buggerin' aboot w' uns?? Blind Freddie would.

Jack
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
johnito
Heliman
Location: New Mexico

She'll be right if ya strike "explained" and replyce with "installed".

I reckon I moight type a bit too fast at times.

Jack
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

Ahh see now all of a sudden we get a response .. the word tight when put into context with this POS manufactured system would mean i now have an acceptable level of slop in the tail system, but then a raptor 90 has the same grips as a 50 and 30 with 2 ball bearings no thrusts so i'm not really bothered that they are in as s about face,
coz if that works this will.

6 to 10 times as fast i don't think so have you bothered to read the gear ratio between tail and main rotor?

I think you'll find its 4.67 to 1

You are making assumptions and appling full size principles to toys, just keep them in the pram.

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

I note you mention the assymetry of ID.... but should that also apply to the OD??
Or did the factory that made that bit forget to plate them?


Give you a while to read your reference text.....

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

johnito....it's pointless explaining these concepts to some of the people on here. They don't and will never understand things like this as they simply do not have that level of intelligence or refuse to believe the designers know what they are doing. I took all the slop out of my freya tail until the blades didn't rock at all as I had a tail buzz and was trying anything to get rid of it. It made ZERO difference.....in fact the tail was so rigid it was worse. The centripetal force on the blades and thrusts will be large and these hold the blades in the correct position while allowing dual axis flapping when required during rotation. Funny how the sceadu tail blades rock widly side to side with only one radial and one thrust bearing but because it is a heli that has been around and developed by Hirobo...it is commonly known and accepted by those that fly them as being "ops normal"

HAS ANYONE ASKED THE SYNERGY BUILDERS IF THIS IS PART OF THE DESIGN CRITERIA......

CAN YOU REALLY TELL THE DIFFERENCE DROID? CAN YOU? I guess you are one of those guys that can also tell the huge difference between running CF frames and metal bearing holders over G10?

AGAIN!!!! A venture 90 (stock) won the Taiwan event. I ain't buying one because they don't personally do anything for me but the differences in flight you are talking about must be so minute as to be undetectable by the average user.....that does include you Droid.

Man I can't understand why you guys get wrapped up in all this baloney
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
johnito
Heliman
Location: New Mexico

Ye canna change t' laws o' physics, captain.

even for verra verra sma' rotors.

Re ratios: You are correct, sorta. Real ratios are on the order of 1.5:1 up to 4:1 .. but they are still pretty damned fast.

In the Century, Raptor, Hirobo, Ergo, and Kalt manuals, great care is taken to ensure that the tail and main thrust washers are NOT installed arsey-farsey by some fuoolish burkey. But go ahead and do as you will... and tell a' yer mates. See how many still want to stand next you when you run up your machines wi' their silly backwerds thrust bearings.

Jack
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

And whos getting wrapped up..

That tail buzz you refer to ..maybe gyro gain too high coz someone told you it had to be as close to 100 on the atv?? Or Servo arm too short/long coz the manufacturer said set it to 12mm or do you use one of those access credit card servo arms you know "your flexible friend"

I'm no lemming i listen to everything and pick out what is plausable

Dont insult my intelligence here i've set up a glasshouse for ya'll to do that

You don't know me, you don't who i am or what i am.

Has anyone asked if ball links being undersize was part of the criteria
?

"CAN YOU REALLY TELL THE DIFFERENCE DROID? CAN YOU? I guess you are one of those guys that can also tell the huge difference between running CF frames and metal bearing holders over G10?"

Two letters ( between d and g and y and i on the keyboard)

I bought this heli so i didn't have to buy upgrades, carbon this ally that.

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
johnito
Heliman
Location: New Mexico

Slop v Sloppiness

Slop is that condition induced by one of two radially mating surfaces being slightly out of spec, allowing motion.

Designed slop is that condition where motion within tight limits of range is achieved by DELIBERATELY making the inner piece a bit small.. or the outer piece a bit large. Designed slop is used by smart engineers who must work withing tight budgets or at small scales.

If a housing is 0.002" oversize relative to its insert, that is probably desighn slop.

If one thrust washer fits the shaft tightly while the other washer has 0.005" slop, that is certainly design slop, allowing a bit of freedom for the thrust assembly to pivot about the tight washer... especially if the manual make special point of mentioning it in italics, bold-faced.

Sloppiness is a condition commonly induced in the young/foolish/arrogant/untrained (redundancies here??) when they do NOT understand engineering of products for mass production and cheap sale... particularly of products capable of very high velocities at failure, killing users or spectators en masse if misused.

I hope this helps, but I reckon it won't.

Jack
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

And while i'm on my soap box.....

I have a suggestion for you, if you send those high precision centering servos back and buy some cheap ones, because there isn't a pilot here that can obviously tell the difference (me included of course), you can buy more books to read all about helicopter physics.

You don't need high end servos on this machine whats the point of it centering if the swash wont??

But of course you'll reply all my birds have 148's in them you don't need more than that.

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-11-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

The thrust race ain't holding the tail together its that washer and 3mm bolt and the threads in the hub if you've got to page A23 yet!!

Which i suspect you haven't as you are still probably dial indicating your fan hub.

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-12-2006 Over year old.
 
 
johnito
Heliman
Location: New Mexico

Gibbons on education:

English historian Edward Gibbon (1737-1794) put it this way: "The power of instruction is seldom of much efficacy except in those happy dispositions where it is almost superfluous."

Owd sod was roight, eh?

Jack
09-12-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

Seems like you need to lay off those pills!

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-12-2006 Over year old.
 
 
3 pages [ <<    <     1     ( 2 )     3     NEXT    >> ]1158 viewsPOST REPLY
CarbonXtreme . Midland Helicopters . HeliProz

.
.
Synergy R/C Synergy N9 > Tail Rotor blade Grips Play
 PRINT TOPIC Advertisers 

Subscribe to This Topic

Thursday, November 20 - 9:31 pm - Copyright © 2000 - 2008 runryder.com | email | link to rr | runryder needs cookie