RunRyder - Shuttle E-conversion - Best bang for the buck ??

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e-Electric Conversions > Shuttle E-conversion - Best bang for the buck ??

cliffbarrimore
Senior Heliman
Location: Farnborough, Hampshire, Sunny UK

I think you will be happy with your t-rex 600, very nice heli...

I am still very slowly gathering parts to do my shuttle conversion, just need a motor, but not in any rush as I have 4 gallons of nitro to get through and with me currently burning about 1 gallon a year its going to be a while before the shuttle sees an electric motor!

12-06-2007 08:55 AM

liljalepeno
Heliman
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Gentlemen,

I'm looking to covert my shuttle to electric, your posts above have convinced me!
I'm unsure about which motor / esc combo to go for.....?
I have a bunch of lipo packs I use for rc car racing, they are 2s2p 7.2v packs, can these be used for the conversion?
I am thinking or pairing them up in series to get 14.4v, will this work?
I would like to keep them in their original format so that I can use them in both rc cars and the shuttle conversion.

Any ideas if the kontronic 45-08 will work well enough on 14v to fly the heli?

Many thanks,

Karl

12-08-2007 03:55 PM

fergus
Veteran
Location: Ireland

That would mean 4s which is not enough for the shuttle in my view. If you could go 6s with 3 packs it would be better. Don't pair packs like that unless they are identical i.e capacity, manufacturer etc.

What is the capacity of the packs? what make? what C rating?

The Kontronik motors are great I use the 45-09 in my shuttle on 5s lipo. The 45-08 has a Kv of about 800 that would give a motor speed of 11520 when applied to the gear ratio means a headspeed of barely 1000rpm which is not enough the low voltage would also mean high current draw so things would get hot and flight times would be too short

Regards

Fergus

12-13-2007 08:35 PM

liljalepeno
Heliman
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Hi Fergus,

Thanks for coming back to me. I totally understand what your saying.
I have spent nearly 30 hours this week reading posts on RunRyder and I am getting a much better appreciation for the physics involved.

The RC car packs are all 4900mah 7.4v 20c packs from the same manufacturer.
I would prefer to use these over buying new packs if possible.

I see now that given the gear ratio of the Shuttle and Kv rating of the motor on the voltage of 2 x 2s2p packs, the head speed would be too low to fly.

What would you think if I put a three or four blade head on the Shuttle?
Given the lift would nearly double, the headspeed would not need to be so high......
The math is telling me that it could work?
Is it as easy as this or is there other factors I am missing?
Would the motor have the torque on the voltage to turn a three/four blade head?

If I have to go new lipos then so be it but it such a shame when I have so many car packs ready to be used.....

12-13-2007 10:13 PM

fergus
Veteran
Location: Ireland

P901 has a shuttle with a 3 blade head and the watts required to hover are very similar to my own heli with the standard head and flybar so I don't know if thats a runner.

I think if you went with 3 packs at a time (6s) and the Kontronik 45-08 you would have a good match for aerobatics and about 9 minute flight times (1800rpm theoretical not factoring losses in the gear train and other losses). For a more sedate headspeed (1550 or so) the 45-07 might be a better choice again assuming 6s.
The wiring loom will be a bit of a mess but should not be a problem and could be hidden under the canopy.

Going 6s will rule out the Jazz 80-06-18 ESC as the voltage would be too high. The next Jazz up does not have a built in BEC so speed controller choice will likely mean running a seperate receiver battery or seperate BEC or a different manufacturer to the motor (not a problem).

Running 3 identical packs in series is fine but just make sure they are balanced and equal voltage before each use (not one pulled from the rc car while the other two had been rested!).

I have not read of anyone running 4s on the shuttle but have just looked at the numbers and think it may be feasable. Flight times with your packs will be only about five or six minutes gentle flying max.

A 10deg climb out on my eShuttle required almost 1000watts so taking this as an absolute max we can see the sums:

1000/14.8= 67amps max (the tangos are rated for 70amps max)

I found almost 500 watts in the hover so if you take the middle ground as an average:

750/14.8= say 50amps

4.9/50= 5.88 *.8= 4mins 40 seconds. This is using my power requirements as a guide, your heli would be lighter so I would think 5mins would be your limit. If you do go 4s you would need a motor with a KV of about 1000 so I would suggest the Tango 45-10 (kv 1080) and the Jazz 80-06-18 ESC (This will remove the receiver battery and save more weight. Don't get the 40-06-18 it wont handle the current). Don't expect Glow engine performance with this setup though it will be quite and very sedate.

Where are you flying in Dublin?

12-13-2007 11:32 PM

liljalepeno
Heliman
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Hi Fergus,

Thanks again for coming back to me.
I fly in the Phoenix Park, although this year has been a bit of wash out.
I only fly scale so a sedate performance is exactly what I'm looking for.
I don't mind the short flight time as I have many packs so I can just cycle them and make up the flight time that way.
The more I look into this, it might just be worth spending the cash and getting two or three decent 6s flight packs and just using them for the shuttle.
I'm waying up the odds on this conversion v's a new trex 600E and 50 scale body.
There is not much in the difference.
I'll search again for motor/esc/battery combo's and see what I can find.
Given the spec you detailed in your last post, it might be possible to find similar electronics that would do the job a bit cheaper than the Jazz/tango combo.....

12-14-2007 12:09 AM

fergus
Veteran
Location: Ireland

You are correct the Kontronik are expensive but would be considered top of the line and are really hassle free.

Airthunder packs are good quality and safe. With the current exchange rates with the dollar they would be a good choice if bought direct from them. They offer a discount when buying multiple packs. I use their 3s packs in my small trex 450V2.

I don't fly scale so am not sure which would be the best option for scale bodies (trex or shuttle). The trex will give you a motor and ESC with the kit though.

If you do convert the shuttle let me know how it goes. If you check my gallery you will see how I eliminated the clutch in my conversion which I think is a good idea for saving weight. If you do that ensure whatever ESC you chose has a 'soft start' option. I had previously invested alot in the shuttle with Quick UK parts so thats what drove me to convert it. Cost wise you may be right about just starting from scratch with a purpose built electric. Especially if you have other glow helis and plan to continue using glow fuel.

Keep us posted

Regards

Fergus

12-14-2007 12:28 AM

Chris
Senior Heliman
Location: Staffordshire England

liljalepeno

I have converted both a shuttle and a hughes 300 to electric and can safely say after trying various motors/esc's that Kontronic is by far the best way to go.

They run extremely cool at about 19 amps with the tango 45-06 on the hughes and 45-07 on the shuttle with the bell body and both use the 55-10-32 esc's.

I have started to use the Flight Power 5350 6s light batteries and get around 14 minutes flying time.

Some pictures in my gallery

Chris

12-14-2007 11:17 AM

Mtn Heli Man
Heliman
Location: Jasper Ga

Making the Conversion

Hi all,

A friend of mine gave me his old Shuttle ZX and a bunch of spare parts. After reading this thread I am going to make the econversion and use it as a training Heli for some of the new folks at our field. I may call on a few of you for some help and input.

Thanks for all the good info.

Todd

12-15-2007 02:31 AM

Richard Morgan
Heliman
Location: Virginia Beach, Virginia USA

Shuttle conversion

This is just an update. My E conversion of the Hirobo Shuttle with a Funkey Jet Ranger body just passed 55 flights, without a single glitch. I am still running 6s2p A123's and the Neu 1907 1.5Y motor. I have tried the Align 75amp and the CCHV45 ESC and both work perfectly. Even with hard punchouts and High powered high speed turns everything still comes down cool as a cucumber. Average 12 min flights. I am now quite sold on the A123's, as I also run them on my Trex 600. If you decide to try these great batteries, I recommend again the Hyperion 1201i charger. I will post some pictures very soon.

As to motor selection for this conversion, I am also a fan of the Kontronics motors, but they are also quite expensive. Whereas the Neu 1907 series motors are reasonable in price, and are of very high quality. I personally have never had a problem with them.

01-02-2008 01:17 PM

azerty
Heliman
Location: France

Hello ,to France
I am converting my Shuttle Plus to electric with the HHI conversion

Motor : Hacker C5019XL KV is 1015 rpm/v
ESC : Castle Creation PHX 85HV
Batteries : Turborix 18.5v 5s 5000mAh 120$
Flightpower Evo Lite5350mah 5S $$$$$

The Flight Time; For the Turborix 8min and 9min for the Flightpower
The cut off of lipo is 4.3v
Head speed at 70% on the governor equals 1650 rpm on the head

Thanks to Fregus, P901, Csc For the details of their convertion

Some pictures