rrTV-PHOTO   New HD TV
HOME   rrTV-PHOTO   GALLERIES   MY GALLERY   HELP-FAQ
myHOME PM pmRR MEMBERS 305 ONLINE 42 EVENTS SEARCH REGISTER  START HERE
 
40 pages [ <<    <     3      4     ( 5 )     6      7     NEXT    >> ]23178 viewsPOST REPLY
CanoMod . Futaba-RC . A Main Hobbies

.
.
Clubs and Associations > Texas Renegade Rotorz
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

Everyone,
I agree. And I do want to make it clear that there are a few officers of the club that have been going out of their way to try and get the field to accept Heli Pilots. I would like to point out that Jerry D., Bobby Y. and Matt C. have been very accepting and helpful to us. I know they are stuck between a "rock and a hard place" and are doing what they can but at times it seems they are fighting an uphill battle.

I do enjoy going to the field but it is getting very tiresome. It seems like everytime I show up at the field someone, usually a plane pilot, comes marching down to where I'm at and I get the lecture on one thing or another. I have yet to only break one rule that I am aware of and that would be not displaying my freq. numbers on my radio. but I have been lectured, humiliated, told to go here fly here, no go fly there, etc. so much that I could vomit. I have seen these young guys harrassed and treated sorely so much so that several of them have left the club to go to other fields. It amazes me at the cold shoulder treatment we receive. The day of the "mini FF" I myself walked down the line of Plane Pilots and informed them that we would be having BBQ, hamburgers, hotdogs, drinks etc and we, the heli pilots, would like to offer them food & drinks today. For the most part I was ignored, given the cold shoulder and barely even acknowledged! Later at the end of the day one of the heli pilots wanted to "lighten his cooler" and wanted to take drinks up to the few airplane pilots that were there. I went with him and frankly I was embarrased at how he was treated. He was pretty much ignored and treated like a nuisance. They were extremely rude and I was honestly, very embarrased.

Another example? There are two really nice guys that have recently started learning to fly with a trainer at this field. Both of them are brothers from Hong Kong. I, and a few others, have noticed that even the plankers won't acknowledge these poor guys. They are treated as outcasts and sadly so, they feel this way also. I approached them and tried to make them feel welcome and they were VERY receptive. They are just super nice guys, overly nice actually, that want to learn to fly. But, they make a point of trying to show up at the field when I am there and gravitate down towards us heli fliers as we are acceptive and kind towards them. Again, I am embarrased at their treatment and how I can plainly see that they feel as outcasts. This and our treatment shows an obvious pattern of discrimination against a certain type of pilot. I hate to go here but it seems as it's getting to the point of where I/we have almost no choice. These "gentlemen", and I use that word very lightly, forget that this is not privately owned property, it is City property. Even though they do lease the property from the City of Austin the city bears some responsibility and will not take kindly to this "growing problem". ALL PILOTS should be welcome. Maybe if the City of Austin and the field receive a letter from an attorney threating litagation maybe that will get the point across?? Won't cost me a dime as one side of my family is littered with attorneys, all or most of them co-owners/founders of their own law firm. They have been advised of the events taking place at this field and kept current up until the mini-FF. Is this what we have come to?? I hope not but it sure seems to be heading in that direction as it is getting to the point of where it seems they have left me no choice.

I have tried to fit in at this field. I have gone out of my way to try and "smooth things over". Yet it seems nothing has changed. I organized this event in hopes that it would help "warm the field" to heli fliers but instead it accomplished the exact opposite. Up until Saturday morning the Preisident and I hadn't spoken but I thought we had ended that as we spoke and seemed to make ammends Saturday morning. He came down and spoke to all the guest heli pilots, even said we/they were welcome at the club as guests, just make sure and follow the rules and have your AMA card(which they all did). I was very disappointed to hear of his "remarks" made in the LHS, stating that he would ban helicopters from HCAM.

I don't see where somewhere around 6-7 visiting pilots, a few of which inteneded to join the club, is such a "huge problem which destroyed four years of work"! I, and many other pilots thought it was a great and productive day for everyone. There were only a few airplane pilots at the field through out the day and with the exception of a few "isolated incidents" things went very well. Or so we thought................


John

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Hunter67
Heliman
Location: Austin, Tx

Saturday Fun Fly

I am a newbie to Heli's, having been introduced to it by SubSailor (my brother in law). I have been out to the field a few times to watch him and others fly. I was bitten with the bug that I just last week purchased a 50 from Rick's and can't wait to build it and start hovering and such.

I was at the FF on Saturday and thoroughly enjoyed myself! It was a blast seeing all the helis fly and all the tricks that the experienced pilots were doing. The people I met (Javier, Mike, etc.) were friendly and fun to be around.

Even the few times that I have been there, I have noticed the attitude of the plane flyers toward the helis. I do not understand it; other than assuming it is old grumpy men who are not truly happy with their lives. I hope this works out; and I hope the plane flyers can become more like one of them named Jerry (I think thats his name). He has been very nice to me every time I have walked down their row looking at the planes.

Anyway, a freaking big thumbs up to the FF and all the great people that I met! I am totally excited about getting my heli going and getting involved with everything that is going on.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
jperch
Senior Heliman
Location: Round Rock, Tx USA

John,
If the three officers/members you mention are truly active in trying to change things for the better, then I applaud them with all sincerity.

Unfortunately, it only takes a few old codgers with nothing better to do than make other people's lives miserable to zap the motivation right out of well intended people. I have lived that myself.

Also, I would like to state that I fully understand the desire to communicate the rules of the field to any guest fliers. This also includes those rules that may not actually be written down but are considered the standard of etiquette for that field. For the most part, it is a matter of safety. Perfectly understandable. BUT, there are many methods that can be employed to accomplish this.

Unfortunately, it seems that the manner chosen by many at that club fosters ill will and contempt. Potential new members are left feeling ostracized. The most unfortunate thing is that most of these types of stories involve the very top of the officers list, the president himself.

In my opinion, the president should be a leader. This particular president seems to be very effective at leading that club down a path that fosters hate and disrespect.

I don't know if litigation (or the threat thereof) would be very effective. Taking the matter to the city will likely result in a loose-loose situation. It always seems to.

Perhaps it might be better to take this to the AMA? I don't know. But it seems the core leadership of that club is doing the exact opposite that the leadership of the AMA projects.

There are actually a growing number of people getting into this hobby. The problem is that they are buying cheap park flier type setups. They see no need to join AMA or a local club. Why should they? Think about this scenario: I am a newbie. I go to the LHS and buy one of those Park Zone (or what ever brand you like) complete ready to fly setups. Everything I need to fly. The owner of the LHS recommends I go to the local club field to get some help. He points me to the HCAM field. I show up with my plane and I get treated like every newbie I have ever heard about gets treated by these jerks. First I get completely ignored. Then when I try to make the first move, I get the cold shoulder. So, I just try to fly. Then I get someone jumping in my face (possibly while I am still trying to fly) screaming at me about rules. What do you think I will do next? You got it. I will pack my stuff and go to the park next door and fly on my own. Okay, so my little 27Mhz setup will not effect the 72Mhz setups of these guys. But more and more manufacturers are coming out with park flyer type stuff on 72Mhz. These guys that this club piss off and make feel unwelcome will just go down the street and fire up on their own. They are going to shoot down that giant P38 or Mustang or whatever. When these old guys try to find out who shot them down, the park flyer guy will either be long gone or, better yet, give the old fart the same treatment he received when he tried to get help in the first place. Perhaps, that is the wake up call these jerks need.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
KennyS
Veteran
Location: Marble Falls, Tx

John,

I am currently a member of two other clubs in the area, "Arca in Austin, Highland Lakes Flyers in Kingsland. Both clubs have outstanding members that help promote the hobby no matter if it is planes or heli's. I have not yet seen any hostility's towards us renegade hili pilots in anyway form or fashion.

Fact is I really did have a great time on Saturday! Saying that, maybe we should all pool together and join that field and give them something to bit?h about. I for one would be more than willing to do that. The field is absolutely fantastic and would be a great meeting place. One thing for sure, there is strength in numbers.

As far as the HCAM, they do not understand that we spend hours upon hours going over or checking our machines before we go out and fly so we can be as safe as possible. They should in fact receive us with open arms because we do bring a high level of professionalism to the sport that is not common with the average plank field. I have seen my self on numerous occasions far to many plane guys come out with equipment that is would not be suitable for a abandoned airfield, but none the less they go up.

Just for the record. I am not ashamed to say that I enjoy flying both heli's and airplanes. Fact is I am building an Edge 540 & Extra 300, both of which are electric. "Dang you Joe" So no one can say that I am bi-used. Further more, I am more then happy to help anyone that is willing to listen and learn no matter if it is an airplane or heli.

In ending. I will be more than glad to contribute for the Saturday's activity's. Just let me know where to mail the check or send a paypal.

Kenny
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

JPerch,
Your absolutely right, your points are well taken. On your statement
Quote 
I don't know if litigation (or the threat thereof) would be very effective. Taking the matter to the city will likely result in a loose-loose situation. It always seems to.
I don't mean it as a threat, it's just the facts and pretty much all I feel I have left. I feel as if I almost have no choice. I feel like a chained dog that someone just keeps poking with a stick. I realize that it will(and have been advised so as well) most likely result in a "lose-lose" situation but the ball is not in my court. This problem could easily come to an end and in my opinion and many others as well, it's an easy solution. We all learned this when we were kids(though it seems some have forgotten this long ago), we've heard our parents tell it to us a thousand times; BE NICE or your all gonna pay. It's really just that simple. That's all it would take or whats going to end up happening is everyone is going to have to take their ball and go home. It's just that simple. They want to play with their ball but won't allow me and others to play with ours.

Am I happy about that? Hell no, I don't want that at all but I am sick and tired of this crap already. I've tried to be nice, I've done just about everything I can think of, it seems that I/we can do nothing right, try as I might. I'm at my wits end. I've offered them money and I even wrote them a very sincere letter of apology hoping to smooth things over even though I feel as though nothing was really done wrong, or intentionaly anyway. We'll see how it turns out. But I do thank you for your support.

John

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
RCtaz
Veteran
Location: Leander, TX

Im sorry I have not been able to get on line again to now.

John,
I had a great time saturday and look forward to getting together again with all of you at the south field. I have made my mind up that I am going to join the club down there just because I like the field so well. I encourage all of us to join the field and meet again in a few weeks as members and have another good time. The dues would be about what landing fee's for any other funfly would be and would directly affect the club for the better.

Im not saying we should put it in there face, but embrace then by showing we are all stand up pilots willing to belong to there club. And along that same line they cant say anything about a bunch of club members getting together at there club to fly together can they?

If anything we should learn a lesson from this and make sure we double check with any "host" clubs we go to and make sure its all been approved before 20+ heli's set up camp at there field.

With years of dealing with different clubs I have learned that its impossible to please all the members and there is always going to be a couple of "old" timers gripping about stuff that shouldnt matter to anyone else and like all wounds this to will heal but be turn open again sometime in the future.

~Texas Renegade Rotorz~
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

Kenny,
It was great meeting you Saturday. Glad you stopped by to say hello to everyone. You have some good ideas that might work. Part of my intentions for this little get together was in hopes of gaining new membership for our club. I could only hope that some people would still be willing to join but from what I've heard as of late, that ain't going to happen.

I appreciate your genorosity but I have already offered to pay them double the "landing fee" for each pilot. Seeing as how I "organized" this event then I am willing to take responsibility for my actions. I read and re-read the rules and felt I was doing nothing wrong, but a "vocal few" feel otherwise. Seems like I'm continuely bumping my head up against the wall here.

I have been told pretty much what you have said about the ARCA field. As a matter of fact a few of our members have left HCAM and joined ARCA for this exact reason. They told me they have just had a blast up there and not been "yelled at once". I'm a stubborn ole bastard though(as if that isn't very obvious! ) and continue to keep my hopes up that something will change down here but should worse come to worse down here then I guess you'll be seeing me up there! I honestly hope it doesn't come to that though. Thanks again Kenny.

John

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

Mike,
We must have posted at the same time as I didn't see yours until now. Honestly I'm a little shocked that you and Kenny would still be willing to join our field! I figured that most of you guys were gone, never to be seen again! Maybe ya'll are on to something here so lets do a little roll call and just see what we can come up with here. Here we go:

OK Gentlemen, I know that some of you may once again have a sour taste in your mouth over what has happened here but if your following this thread then hopefully your getting what Mike(RCTaz), KennyS and myself are trying to do here. So, how many of you would be willing to join HCAM and show up as members? I don't think they would have a problem with that as a member is a member right? So maybe if some of you stood up and said "HERE!!" things can change for the better. Any takers? If so please post below and let me know, hate to sound like a politician here but "We can make a difference"!

So far we have:
KennyS
Mike(RCTaz)

Any other brave takers????

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Hunter67
Heliman
Location: Austin, Tx

Fun Fly Chaos

I didn't get a chance to go into much detail on my earlier post as I was getting ready to head to lunch; but I wanted to go into a little more in depth on my feelings on this dogfight going on at the S. Austin field, since I am basically still an outsider.

I am an outsider because I have just now bought my first heli (still in the box) and have only been to the field a handful of times to watch the flying. When I was first invited by my brother in law, I thought that he was going to be flying planes and helis --- I wasn't sure what his main focus was. So when I got to the field the first time, I was pumped about seeing the planes and helis that were flying around that day (about a month ago). When I found out that he was only into helis, I focused on that part of the field for awhile.

Eventually I wandered down to the plane area with my 11 year old and tried to visit with the pilots and show my kid the different kinds of models. I'm sure they knew I was a newbie and that it was kind of like a 'kid in the candy store' mood I was in; but I didn't care. However, I was put off pretty quick by their stand-offish moods. Only one bothered to shake my hand or even acknowledge my kid; and his name was Jerry (I think). He was actually very cool and took time to explain to my son about this plane and how he built it, etc. The other guys wouldn't even nod their heads when I smiled and said hello to them.

Later in the afternoon I noticed some of the older plane flyers coming down and talking over and over about the rules and etc. Each one came down at a different time and said that exact same thing (WTF??). If they were trying to intimidate -- it was a miserable failure.

Anyway, I could immediately tell that there was tension, and as I listened and learned from hearing the helis talk, I could tell it was old and grumpy versus young and just wanting to enjoy a hobby.

This has not put me off from the hobby at all; I am just disappointed with the infantile attitudes of some of the so-called adults. The way they act is exactly what I am trying to teach my 11 year old what not to do in his life.

Anyway, again -- big thumbs up to the organizers of the heli fun fly and to the factory reps that made it down there. All you guys were great and I am definitely glad I chose helis over planes.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SteveH
rrProfessor
Location: Texas

John,

First, I'd like to say I enjoyed meeting you and flying at your club's field Saturday, and thanks for the invitation to come up. Second, I'd like to appologize if I unintentionally did anything to upset anyone up there, weather it was with my flying or anything else. I would like to join your club also, but the distance is just prohibative. I do have a question, however, and it is does your club have any requirements for membership such as a required vote by the existing membership? Just curious.

Thanks again,

SteveH
Magnum Fuel
AMA76186
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Hunter67
Heliman
Location: Austin, Tx

Joining HCAM

Just saw SubSailors post. Mark me down for joining HCAM. Now I just got to build this thing....
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

Hunter,
I'm glad that you haven't allowed this "soap opera" turn you off to this hobby. There are PLENTY of good people in this hobby who are more than willing to help. Jerry is his name and he is an asset to the hobby and to our flying field. I can only hope/wish that the rest of the people in this hobby could be like him. Don't give up and get to cranking on that heli!

So Jeff, can we add you to our list??

Edit: Oops, just saw your second post, I'll add ya. So, so far we have:

New joining members of HCAM:
KennyS
Mike(RCTaz)
Jeff(Hunter67)

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Defiant
Key Veteran
Location: Leander , Texas

John,

I know we've already talked on the phone about all this, but I just thought i'd say its sad to see this get turned 180* from where it was saturday evening.

When you and I first talked about this, our soul intensions where merely to get everyone together and meet to have a good day of fun, meet new people, and hopefually scout a new field to fly at.

For the most part I feel we acomplished that, but unfortunately its obvious that our good time was simply the calm before the storm.
As always, there is someone who will make waves, but thats everywhere...not just HCAM. I'm sorry that this has caused more trouble than good for you. Like I told you on the phone, just let me know what needs to be done to compensate HCAM for our actions saturday.

To all who attended,

Thanks for participating, it was never anybody's intent for this to be the outcome.... For that, I sincerely appologize. I hope that all of you did enjoy the gathering.


-Javier
P.S
If joining HCAM will help, then mark me down.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

HI Steve,
It was great meeting you too! Honestly I don't think anyone really did anything to cause this problem. It's just your typical "this is our playground, we don't like your toys and we don't like you so go away" syndrome.

As for your question, as far as I know voting is not required for new members, just fill out the application pay your dues and your a member. Membership fee's are $5 a month or $60 a year, they do prorate it for your first year so for someone to join now it would be $25 plus the initial $10 joining fee. AMA is required. Thanks for coming and I'm sorry for whats happened, all this "spatting back and forth stuff".

John

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

Hi Javier,
Hey man, don't worry about it. I know that deep down neither of us meant it to turn out this way and to be honest it was really by no fault of our own. We did what we thought was going to be a good thing and a few "sour grapes" had a fit. What can ya do. I'm damn glad you came down, you helped many people that day and my BIL is a convert! He initially wanted to get into planes but upon his experience with the plankers he decided against it and went with helis!! He just received his new Hirobo heli, JR 9303, OS .50 Hyper and all the goodies to go with it!

So seriously man, you still willing to join?? Wow, my hat is off to you. Thank you Javier. I'm looking VERY forward to having you and the others down there flying with us. Thanks man.

John

Well this is a turn of events!! So, now we have:
New joining members of HCAM:
KennyS
Mike(RCTaz)
Jeff(Hunter67)
Javier(Defiant)

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
SubSailor
Veteran
Location: Austin, TX.

Everyone,
Just as an FYI, I just received a phone call from a "family member", they have obtained the name and phone number of the offical at the City of Austin parks and recreation for us to file complaints with IF this isn't handled properly(Apparently, the city parks and recreation department has 'regional' type managers that are in charge of certain sections of the cities parks). Anyways, she told me that we can go ahead and call if we like or she would be glad to start the process and send a "letter of notification"(or something like that), whatever that is, to the City of Austin to get the ball rolling. At this time I'd like to with hold the name & number until we see what's going to happen as I would like to not stir the pot if at all possible. I'm hoping that this can be handled in a nice and civil manner. I have yet to receive a single response from any club official in reference to my letter of apology. Bing, balls in their court............

John

Fromeco Field Rep.
A day without sunshine is, well.., alot like night time.
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Hunter67
Heliman
Location: Austin, Tx

Good job. I'm hoping that this will soon blow over. I just think that they were entirely intimidated by so many helis showing up.

You know, sometimes its easier to just be friendly and you might shock yourself at actually enjoying meeting new people.

If you sent the letter by e-mail, give it at least until tonight. Some of those old fellas might actually still work during the day...
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
averenVeteran - Location: Austin, TX -
I think everyone has the right idea about changing the club from the inside out. You may not initially reap the benefits that a planker would have with the club, but eventually the heli pilots will get some respect once they start showing up and making their claim.

I wasn't at the fun fly...but it sounds like everyone had a good time. I'm still working out some issues with the Rappy and decided to hit the local glider field and do some glider flying rather than rushing to get the heli done and not knowing what to expect (receiver and possibly governor issues...not fun!)

I have been to the HCAM field once. And my experience wasn't all that great. It was a while back so I can't remember any names and I'll spare the details since there has been plenty of the same thing being stated in posts above.

$60 membership isn't bad at all. I would join if I thought I would ever use the field, but I don't get south that often at all.

Jared

Knowledge is Power, Power Corrupts, Study Hard...Be EVIL!
07-17-2006 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
sabrams
Heliman
Location: Austin, TX

Everyone,

Maybe some impressions from an outsider would be of benifit.
I just bought a Lepton EX (and a Hirobo XRB to practice with) and will soon be looking for some set-up help.

I went to the club Saturday just to watch. I was reluctant to approach any pilots, because I have been to this club once before (when I wanted to get involved with fixed-wing aircraft) and it's not a very friendly place. As others have mentioned, there seem to be an inordinate number of grumpy people.

Having said that, however, I knew in the first five-minutes of watching, that there were going to be problems. I'm not sure why you people didn't see it. Maybe too involved. A scale Cessna was trying to fly the pattern when a heli pilot simply began flying vertical maneuvers right in the middle of the runway. I saw that Cessna take evasive action on a number of occasions. No wonder the fixed-wing people are pissed.

I think you have to be much better organized, in terms of who can fly where, if both fixed-wing and rotary aircraft are to co-exist. They make it work at real airports, so why can't it work at r/c airports?

As far as the club is concerned, put me down on the list of people who are willing to join. If we can get enough people who are able to see both sides of the story, it might just be possible to wrestle control of the club away from the exclusionists. It's important for the future of the field, and of the hobby, to make sure that EVERYONE is included.

Steve
07-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Texas1
Heliman
Location: Tyler, Texas

If the North club is so accepting of helis, wouldn't it make sense that you all would be members there and have had the mini FF there. Then you could have avoided this problem of so-called unacceptance at the South field. What would you call an acceptable number of guests to invite at one time without proper reservation and notification? This meaning, letting the club have the time to schedule the weekend and notify other members that the field would not be available for casual flying. If you notified a member, did you receive a reply that this weekend would be ok? Again, it sounds as though the North field would be your best option and you should be members there due to their peace and love philosphy.
07-18-2006 Over year old.
 
 
40 pages [ <<    <     3      4     ( 5 )     6      7     NEXT    >> ]23178 viewsPOST REPLY
Boca Bearings . Modefo's RC Helicopters . XHELI.COM

.
.
Clubs and Associations > Texas Renegade Rotorz
  UPDATE SCREEN   PRINT TOPIC Advertisers 

Subscribe to This Topic

Friday, September 5 - 9:41 am - Copyright © 2000 - 2008 runryder.com | email | link to rr | runryder needs cookie