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Thunder Power RC . Mikado Modellhubschrauber . GrandRC

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Aerobatic 3D Contest > Multiple stationary flips
 
 
volare
Veteran
Location: Cincinnati Area

I'm having trouble keeping altitude during continuous stationary flips. From what I read the raptor/OS32 combo should have the power to do this with correct timing is. I have tried altering my timing but haven't got it yet? Anybody have some advice?

I have 30% cyclic-->throttle mixing by the way.
10-26-2002 Over year old.
 
 
volare
Veteran
Location: Cincinnati Area

I will try using less tomorrow. Thanks.
10-26-2002 Over year old.
 
 
gforce
Veteran
Location: Jacksonville FL

Head speed can make all the difference in the world. 1850 vrs. 1750 makes a big difference. You woulden't think 100 rpm could make much difference, but it really does. What head speed are you running?
10-26-2002 Over year old.
 
 
mfendley
Senior Heliman
Location: Saint Marys, GA

Speaking of rpm, Glenn - are you flying tomorrow?
10-26-2002 Over year old.
 
 
gforce
Veteran
Location: Jacksonville FL

Mike,

flying? ya that sounds good. I could also use a little help with a pinion for the Raptor 50. Got it today. The bearing fits fine so there is no mod necessary there, but we still have to ream it out from 5mm to 6mm for the shaft to fit. Can we do that also?
10-26-2002 Over year old.
 
 
Parsifal
Veteran
Location: Singapore

Do you guys lose the tail after a little while of continuous flipping?

If i do more than say 6 or 7, all of a sudden the tail swings right around...is this supposed to happen?

Pars?
10-29-2002 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
beast
Veteran
Location: Laurel MD

What gyro are you using Pars?

.Beresford
10-29-2002 Over year old.
 
 
NEM3
Veteran
Location: New Lenox, Il

I've done continuous flips climbing, falling, and then climbing again on both my Raptor 50 and Raptor 60 and my tail has never fallen out.

And as Seneca said, timing is everything. Especially if you want it to climb and fall straight.

Raptor 50 has a 401/9253 and the Raptor 60 has a 502/9253.
10-29-2002 Over year old.
 
 
volare
Veteran
Location: Cincinnati Area

Mine are getting better now. I'm not holding full negative and positive as long now and that is helping. I still need to work on the timing to get them perfectly still.

My tail will usually drift a little from the collective changes but I just correct it(gy240, standard servo). Soon I will try flippin my R60, should be easier.


Thanks for the advice.
10-29-2002 Over year old.
 
 
NEM3
Veteran
Location: New Lenox, Il

The heli has nothing to do with how well it flips. Its all in the pilot. I can actually get my R50 to flip a hella lot better than my 60. But I have also invested a lot of time, money, and experimentation on my current 50 setup.

I have also seen 30 do rising and falling stationary flips very well. It all depends on the pilot. As long as you not hogging the collective then you won't loose headspeed. This is usually when you flips start to fall becuase you collective changes no longer mean anything. And the more you try to fix it the worse it will get until you finally get out of the flip and allow the rotor head to catch up. Or you can just do like I do, go way up high, bog the crap out of the head, then go to 0 deg and keep it flipping. Looks weird falling and flipping at 0°


Also, forgot to mention this. When you bog the head on any heli, the tail is gonna swing out. Its because you loosing tail authority.
10-29-2002 Over year old.
 
 
volare
Veteran
Location: Cincinnati Area

The heli has nothing to do with how well it flips. Its all in the pilot. I can actually get my R50 to flip a hella lot better than my 60. But I have also invested a lot of time, money, and experimentation on my current 50 setup.

You just contradicted yourself within the same paragraph. If the heli has nothing to do with it why can you flip better with your 50?

I have also seen 30 do rising and falling stationary flips very well. It all depends on the pilot.

I know a 30 WILL do it. My statement was it will be EASIER with my 60. Simply because it has more power, a better gyro, and I feel it is set up better, just like you think your 50 is set up better.
10-29-2002 Over year old.
 
 
NEM3
Veteran
Location: New Lenox, Il

Not necessarily contradicting myself. Just telling the truth. Everyone says that 60's fly better than any 30 or 50. Well, I think my 50 flies great. And I can do multiple stationary flips with both my 50 and my 60. Personally I think my 50 does them better because it rolls and flips better. Thus I am spending less time at knife edge with zero lift.

Will a 60 be easier than a 30, heck yah. Why, just like you said, more power behind the heli.

I was merly stating the fact that a 30/50/60/70/80 or 90 heli can do them. But how well the particular heli does them depends largely on how well the pilot can fly the model through them.
10-29-2002 Over year old.
 
 
Parsifal
Veteran
Location: Singapore

I'm using a 401 gyro on a Sceadu 50. and after a number of consecutive flips, the tail loses authority and swings out. I am pretty sure it is my flying but what part of my flying? Am i suppose dto be flying the tail too at all times?
10-30-2002 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
NEM3
Veteran
Location: New Lenox, Il

On my Raptor 50 with a 401, my tail never swings out. But I am also not loading up the head much. I can pretty much carry the same rotor headspeed through the loops and I think that is what has to do with the tail swinging out.

You are right that your losing tail authority. But your problem may not be just the headspeed, or the headspeed at all.

Dare I ask what tail blades you are running.
10-30-2002 Over year old.
 
 
Parsifal
Veteran
Location: Singapore

Standard Sceadu Tail Blades. :-)
10-31-2002 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
NEM3
Veteran
Location: New Lenox, Il

Then that could be your problem. I would recommend changing those out. If you can swing the cash for MS's or NHP's go that route. If not, JR and KSJ make cheaper plastic tail blades that will work just as well.

Prior to my last crash I was running MS 97's on my 50's tail. Haven't been able to find a set of NHP's yet and I already know how the MS perform. So I am using JR 60 size tail blades cut down to 97mm.
10-31-2002 Over year old.
 
 
Heli-Driver
Elite Veteran
Location: Arlington, TX

I've had/have a Raptor 30, 46, 61 and a 70 and not any of them roll or flip like my Fury Extreme, it is simply devine... and it isn't the "pilot" the Fury flies better, bottom line.



Raymond

Predator Gasser SE/231 X 2
Century Helicopters
11-06-2002 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
jimmyhua
Veteran
Location: Guam

Hey Raymond,

If you don't like the way your Raptor flies, tweak it until you do.

First thing to try are to swap out those paddles with MinAir white 3D paddles on your Raptor60. Then try a longer flybar....

Personally, I can't do stationary flips on a 30.

Jimmy
11-06-2002 Over year old.
 
 
NEM3
Veteran
Location: New Lenox, Il

Why not try a set of V-Paddles. Much smoother IMHO.
11-06-2002 Over year old.
 
 
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Aerobatic 3D Contest > Multiple stationary flips
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