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e-E-Flite Blade CP CX 400-3D > CNC Dymanic frame for Blade CP
 
 
Superchicken
Heliman
Location: Houston, Tx

Anyone have this? Mine is on the way!
04-05-2006 Over year old.
 
 
L0stS0ul
Senior Heliman
Location: Virgina - USA

I believe people have issues mounting servos on it and they also have trouble resolving glitching with it.

Good luck
04-05-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

I hope that's not the case. Just picked up the last of the upgrade parts for mine today and will be bolting it all up to the new frame beginning tonight...

The only thing I'm concerned about is the metal to metal "rattling". That'll generate RF noise so I'll be careful to eliminate as much as I can.
04-05-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Superchicken
Heliman
Location: Houston, Tx

Received my Dynamic CNC frame and have most everything mounted. Looks pretty good except they forgot to include the dual motor tail housing. While swapping the servos over i think i lost track of which one was plugged into where on the 4-1. Anyone know the correct plugins????
04-07-2006 Over year old.
 
 
aczakka
Senior Heliman
Location: Connecticut

back right servo is position 1
front servo is postition 2
back left servo is postition 6

main motor plugs in to bottom of the rx on left side
tail motor plugs in on top of the rx on the left side
04-07-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Superchicken
Heliman
Location: Houston, Tx

Thanks!!
04-07-2006 Over year old.
 
 
L0stS0ul
Senior Heliman
Location: Virgina - USA

Here's some things to be on the lookout for:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=497397

I'll be interested to hear if you have the same issues. Good luck
04-07-2006 Over year old.
 
 
bbeverlie
Key Veteran
Location: Hudson,New Hampshire.USA

eek, it sounds like that guy got a ptototype?? Hope
it works better on the blade CP! But the gliching
may be hard to solve if the metal parts are creating
the problem. Look forward to more reports!!

AMA#846952
04-07-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

Man, I hope I don't run into those issues. Started my "upgrade" the other night.. Gonna try and finish it up tomorrow...
04-07-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

I re-read the post on the other forum with my BCP and CNC frame (Flight tech CP13S if it matters) in hand. I'm sure the poster did run into these problems, but I wanted to see for myself. Based on what I'm seeing, I'm not sure any of the listed issues are of much concern.

Quote 

1. Servo mounts are with tape instead of the factory screws. Less secure.


On my BCP, all three servos and the tray for the 4-in-1 unit are taped - looks like double sided carpet tape. I don't see a single screw holding any of the electronics on except the 4-in-1-cover.

Quote 
2. Body doesn't fit. Rubs on servo arms.


The way I'm seeing how the new frame is assembled and the body positioned, I figure the OEM servo arms will have at least 1/4" clearance from the body, including the 1/2" extra width from the CNC frame.

Quote 
3. Servo links are too short to reach new servo positions and don't have enough adjustment to compensate. Must get new links or rotate the servo arms on the shaft (not the preferred method).


Can't comment on this as I've not got the head on mine yet, but the assembly instructions show the servos in pretty much the same relation to the main shaft as they are on the OEM frame. I can see how they could end up short of you don't think about how to mount the servos. No matter in my case because I'm going to make up new links and get rid of those Z-bend links.

Quote 
4. Main gear rubs on frame and requires extra washers to get the needed clearance. This caused the gear to wobble.


Instructions clearly say to use a washer and 2 bearings on the bottom of the main shaft if it rubs on the frame. I measured the distance from the center of the main shaft to the skid mount on the CNC frame with my digital calipers. 1.383". Measuring the main shaft gear from the center to the point of one tooth, I got 1.373" - Not a lot of clearance. I measured the clearance between the main gear and the OEM frame's skid mount. 0.12" Should fit ok in my case.

Quote 
5. Metal frame and metal components causing glitching problems. Still haven't sorted that out yet.


This is one we'll all have to resolve on our own. Stopping metal from moving against other metal will cut down on the RF noise. I imagine I'll need to experiment with ESC locations as well as I'm also going brushless as I build the helo up. The instructions do say to put a drop or two of CA into the skids where the struts connect to stop metal to metal movement.

Quote 
6. Cannot access one of the motor screws after main gear is installed.


Yep, sure looks like the teeth on the main gear will be directly over one motor screw. Could be ok, depending on the pinion size and/or motor diameter. The brushless 370 motor (E-Flite Park 370 3600KV I've got mounted up is smaller in diameter so that screw might just fall inside the gear wheel.

That's how I'm seeing it and I'm going to press on with my buildup. Should I encounter any issues, I'll be sure to post about 'em. Should anyone else run into problems, please post as well.
04-08-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

Just finished the mechanical buildup of the CNC frame on my BCP. Not a lot of problems doing the swap over/conversion and those I encountered were typical of a helo build and didn't require much in the way of thought or time to rectify.

Main gear did require 2 washers between the gear wheel and the lower bearing, but otherwise dropped right in.

Motor screw access was a non-issue as well. I'm using an E-Flite Park 370 (3600KV) brushless motor with an 8T pinion and got the mesh set and had plenty of access to the rear motor mount screw. The folks at E-Flite put some nice clearance "dimples" on the inner part of the gear wheel to make some room for a screwdriver.

Servo installation required a bit of trimming on the lower mounting tab to get the servos (E-Flite EFLRS75's) alingned with the top portion of the mounting surface on the new frame. NOTE: *BEFORE* you mount the servos, plug 'em into the 4-in-1 and get them centered. I had to pull one servo off after I'd stuck it down to re-center it. That double sided tape provided with the new frame sticks VERY well..)

The rest was pretty straightforward and troublefree..

Body mounting *MIGHT* be an issue in getting the mount rods secured to the frame. Instructions say to use CA glue, but I think I'm going to use epoxy as it's not so brittle. It appears as if I can get the mount rods in pretty much the same location as they were with the OEM frame so I shouldn't need to modify the body at all.

I have two minor issues with the frame.

1st, the mounting surface for the rear servos is kinda flimsy as it's a plastic "U" channel. I'm going to cut a small block of balsa to wedge between the open end to stiffen it up a bit.

2nd, there's nowhere to mount the 4-in-1 unless you stick it to the battery tray. I'm going to drill and tap two holes in the front of the frame (Or use Epoxy!) and mount an aluminum "L" bracket to the front of the frame's base and stick the 4-in-1 there.

ESC control will go directly under the gear wheel and all the wiring will be dressed out and secureed nicely. Should have it all done sometime this evening.
04-08-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Superchicken
Heliman
Location: Houston, Tx

I have mine almost finished! waiting on the tail motor mount that they forgot to send with the kit in the first shipment. I found that the set screws for the landing gear were in accessible due to the battery tray blockin access to the set screw holes, and i don't have a allen wrench that small! For the receiver, i cut the tray for the receiver off the carbon frame and used JB Weld to attach to the front of the frame. The canopy pin for the front is attached under the front of the frame with JB Weld, below the motor mount, just inside the front skid mounting holes. The rear canopy pin is CA's to the top of the rear servos. Might be a mistake but we'll see!!
04-17-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

Mine's getting there. Finally ready to get the 4-in-1 taped on and get all the electrics dressed down nice and neat..

Here's the bracket I made to mount the 4-in-1. Front body mount will be epoxied in place underneath it. No need to modify the body to get it all to fit.



Here's a shot of the right side showing servo wire routing. The rear body mount has been epoxied into place just in front of the main shaft. Pushes the body about 1/2" forward of the stock location, but again, I won't need to punch any new holes in it.



Here's a semi-fuzzy pic of the polished tail motor mount. It's a twin motor mount, but I've only gotone of the grey-end GWS motors on it. Gonna use the other mount position for a vertical fin like on an MD500. THIS is why I'm gonna sell my Coolpix 5700 and get a D70S - ^&&$%^ing autofocus junk...



Lastly, the completed rotor head with alum swash and the Bell Hiller upgrade. (Funny how the camera really got this one in focus..heheh)



A helicopter is 10,000 parts spinning rapidly around an oil leak.
04-21-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Superchicken
Heliman
Location: Houston, Tx

I got mine all back together and put a pair of the light wood flat bottoms from Heli-Direct on it. For some reason, at full throttle it will barely get off the ground. Seems the blades are too flexible! Taking it the the LHS today to have it looked at!
04-21-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

Possibly not enough head speed. Full scale heli rotors wouldn't support the weight of the helicopter without centrifugal force to "stiffen" them up. I assume you can see the blades cone as you apply power. That's normal, but you may have too much pitch and not enough head speed.

A larger pinion will increase headspeed but will also reduce available torque. Less pitch will be required so it'll kinda even itself out.

A helicopter is 10,000 parts spinning rapidly around an oil leak.
04-21-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Superchicken
Heliman
Location: Houston, Tx

Well, I removed one of the tail motors, repositioned my antenna to the back of the battery tray so it is under the boom, and tightened the set screws on the frame. I finally did a controlled flight!!!!! I think I need more power now, and maybe Bell Hiller mixer because the response is lousy.

What set up would be good if i decided to go brushless? I read all the posts on it but being new to this it like learning a new language. I'd prefer to upgrade the tail motor to something a little more powerful than the stock one too.

All suggestions welcome!

Thanks, Superchicken!
05-05-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

I can't say this is *THE* setup for a brushless CP, but I run an E-Flite park 370, 3600kv motor and an 8T pinion and a 3 cell LiPo. Math says the headspeed should be right around 2100 RPM and E-flite says that's right where it should be. ESC is a Castle Creations Thunderbird 18.

Unfortunately, I haven't yet got the thing working properly (the heli, not the motor) as I'm struggling to figure out my 9CHP radio (my 1st computer radio) and have some setup issues with it. It appears to have a lot of power compared to stock based on my tracking and test runs with the helo strapped down.

I also did a direct drive tailrotor motor with a GWS "grey cap" motor. (Sorry don't recall the actual GWS part no and the helo is at home today.) It also seems to have a lot of power over the stock geared unit.

A helicopter is 10,000 parts spinning rapidly around an oil leak.
05-05-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

Got most of my "issues" sorted out tonight - pitch curves are still off, but it certainly hovers and has good power. Getting some bad hits on the radio so I'll need to rework antenna routing and double check I've got no metal to metal looseness anywhere.

DD tail is very authorative and I'm going to need to unlearn the "giant" throws of my left thumb that were prevalent with the original TR setup.

I think I'm gonna like this new setup...

A helicopter is 10,000 parts spinning rapidly around an oil leak.
05-06-2006 Over year old.
 
 
JJGONZO
Senior Heliman
Location: Aliso Vuejo, California

Really nice work Skiddz,

What gyro are you using? I have the same frame but after a crash it is not flying like it used to. I haven't been able to get the mixing right. What are your mixing settings?

Thanks is advance.
05-06-2006 Over year old.
 
 
Skiddz
Veteran
Location: Carlsbad, CA

Still using the 4-in-1 for proportional and gyro. I did the channel 3 pin solder hack on the Rx by soldering longer pins to the pins on the circuit board. I cut away the plastic cover blocking channel 3 and just plug my ESC into it. Worked like a charm. I did remove the + wire from the ESC Rx plug so just signal and GND are present on that channel.

Not doing any mixing in the radio. I just did a basic throttle/pitch curve and set the AFR to limit all 3 servo throws so nothing binds at full collective. Still no idle up curves built and no Revo Mix either. Just tweaked the pots on the 4-in-1 to get it close. Still have to fly the tail a little bit, but it's not too bad. It'll get better once I figure out the Revo Mix in the Tx

Still fighting the "yo-yo" altitude control issues and some glitching. Almost have it set up where I don't need more than a click or two of trim to keep it relatively stable hovering in my living room. My GWS tail motor gets REALLY hot after about 10 mins so I need to see what's going on with it or get one of those Fegaio (or however you spell it) brushless motors/ESC for the tail.

Actually, I won't as my Trex SE is due here on Monday and I'll start building that up immediately.

A helicopter is 10,000 parts spinning rapidly around an oil leak.
05-07-2006 Over year old.
 
 
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e-E-Flite Blade CP CX 400-3D > CNC Dymanic frame for Blade CP
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