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Revolution Models . CarbonXtreme . Midland Helicopters

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JR Heli Vibe - Airskipper - Sylphide - Venture > Egro 50 clutch bell "ringing"???
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

I just noticed that at idle my R22 Ergo 50 / OS 50 makes a "ringing" sound I started to check it over and have discovered a "catch" or tight spot when I rotate the main gear by hand. There is also a "scuffing" sound with the catch at the start shaft bearing block, or in the clutch bell itself.
I suspect the start shaft bearing,but, I haven't taken it apart yet. I recently tightened up the tail belt a lot more than it was so it wouldn't "touch" when pressed with a finger as the instuctions call out.
Has anyone experienced this? What do you think it could be?
08-16-2002 Over year old.
 
 
Doug
Elite Veteran
Location: Naples Florida....

Some of that noise comes from the muffler. I don't think the clutch bell can "ring" when the "shoes" are expanded inside

First member of Member of Bearings Anonymous
08-16-2002 Over year old.
 
 
Deja_Vu
Senior Heliman
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

My Ergo type II made a sound similiar to a ringing from the bell. In my case it was the one way bearing in the clutch binding, in conjuction with the clutch bell pinion gear not being locktighted to the start shaft bearing block. Got a new clutch, and some red locktight on the pinion and no more wierd noises.
08-16-2002 Over year old.
 
 
cubeleo
Heliman
Location: San Jose, CA

Hey BladeRunner,

I read this post and both the ringing and the scuffing sound very familiar. I have an Ergo with a TT46. Perhaps our experiences are the same; I'll relate mine...

Scuffing happened to me first. I discovered that the starter hex adapter (possibly the wrong name for this piece), which is attached to the shaft the clutch rides on by a set screw, had slipped. This let the shaft and clutch bell fall a bit, so that when I turned the transmission without the engine running, the top of the clutch shoe assembly would scrape on the clutch bell. At idle, there'd be a constant scrrrrrraaaape sound that sounded like a bad bearing, but of course this all wouldn't be a problem once the clutch was completely engaged. Anyways, it's a rather annoying problem, considering one's choices in retightening the adapter (that I found, anyway). Your first option is to remove the engine, so that you can push up on the shaft from inside the clutch bell and then go through gear mesh and realignment pains AGAIN. Your second option is you can remove just the adapter, pull up on the shaft, then very carefully and gingerly lower the adapter onto the shaft and hoping it doesn't fall down a bit again. SOME falling is completely unavoidable I think. And ofcourse then you have to tighten the adapter's worm screw through the holes in the frame. I chose the second option to avoid realignment hell, and when I was finished, the unavoidable downward movement of the shaft left me with about 1-2 mm of up-down play in the whole clutch/shaft/adapter assembly. Not a good thing, and I'm THIS close to biting the bullet and taking it all apart.

As for the ringing, I notice it most at idle or when I've raised the engine to a faster idle, just prior to spool-up. I'm pretty sure that it's the muffler, as Doug mentioned, but it may be the clutch bouncing around at idle due to the play. Gee, wouldn't it be nice if the two sounds were related and stemmed from a single problem?

I hope this lends SOME insight, and I'd love to hear about further experiences you have with the ringing and scuffing

-Aaron
08-16-2002 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

ringing bell?

Thanks guys, it is only noticable at idle when the clutch would not be engaged. I already had to replace the hex start adapter as it wore out after only three gal.!! It may have been my fault though, I was using a Dewalt 18V cordless (hammer) drill to start my engine after my KSJ start shaft gave up on me and the drill would sometimes hammer at will... I'm sure I got the hex on the shaft with the required tiny "space" to avoid binding,but, it is possible that it has slipped....good call, I will check that out........
08-16-2002 Over year old.
 
 
Doug
Elite Veteran
Location: Naples Florida....

Get all that crap out of your system before you "step up" to the Connie

First member of Member of Bearings Anonymous
08-16-2002 Over year old.
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

Connie?

I was waiting for that Doug.........
08-16-2002 Over year old.
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

No more "ringing"???

Well I think cubeleo nailed it.... The start shaft had indeed slipped allowing the clutch bell to move down slightly...just enough to contact the top edge of the clutch indicated by a slight score mark inside the bell itself. I haven't tried it yet,but, there was about 2mm of play in the hex position......this should be the fix........good call cubeleo......
BTW, I did check the bearings and all are good....
08-18-2002 Over year old.
 
 
cubeleo
Heliman
Location: San Jose, CA

BladeRunnder, sweet! I'm very glad I could pass on some useful info! Did you end up fixing it by taking it completely apart or by retightening it in-place? Also, I wonder if when you try it again, the ringing is fixed!

-Aaron
08-19-2002 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

Ringing?

I ended up removing the clutch bell / start shaft assembly. I tried to do it in place when I changed the hex start to the hardened KSJ part, that didn't work as there is no way to get at the bottom end of the start shaft to hold it while tightening the set screw on the hex without removing the engine.
I found I could do it by dropping the engine down a bit, removing the main gear / main shaft then moving the elevator link all the way up, then the assembly will come out without any trouble.....put it back the same way. I did this to avoid removing the muffler, temp probe (Venom), engine etc. I only had to remove one muffler (KSJ) bolt and loosen the other to get at the engine mounting bolts.......worked out great!!.....Thanks again for your help.....
RunRyder is the best thing since sliced bread!!! Where else could you pick the brains of the worlds most experienced, friendly and knowlegable pilot / builders and get tips like this ????
08-19-2002 Over year old.
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

Problem solved!

The problem WAS the clutch bell contacting the top of the clutch! After reassembling the unit and flying it last night ...all is right with the world once again..........no more "ringing" or scuffing sounds........thanks cubeleo......
08-22-2002 Over year old.
 
 
akpatterson2000
Heliman
Location: Andover, CT

I haven't read all the replies, so sorry if I repeat some things. I too have a 46 with the same problem. First , you must replace the cheap-ass bronze bushing in the bearing blocks with ball bearings. No need to buy after market blocks just tap out the old bearing and measure for new. Rick's has the size you need. You see, the brain surgens at JR didn't consider thrust loading being produced by the weight of the starter. This modification must be done or the problem will return.
09-28-2002 Over year old.
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

My bell WAS ringing!!!!..........Only at idle though.........LOL
10-07-2002 Over year old.
 
 
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JR Heli Vibe - Airskipper - Sylphide - Venture > Egro 50 clutch bell "ringing"???
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