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JR-Spektrum . Gyro Hobbies . E-flite

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HIROBO Freya - Sceadu - Shuttle > Sceadu Service
 
 
ampex456
Senior Heliman
Location: Bayville, NJ

Hello all,

Re: Stripped Main Gears,

For the record, to date, My three Sceadus have not had main gears strip and that was something I was looking for during testing. I am glad to hear Greg, you put out this poll as we have not had many complaints come through here for this problem. To date, I have replaced only two gears, so if others are having this problem, I would really like to know about it. So far main gear sales are low which is another indicator, a good sign.
So please if you read this message, fill out his poll so if this problem is for real and not just isolated, I can handle it accordingly for our market. At our request for our market, Hirobo is looking into the two cases and will consider a material change if warranted. Thanks

Re: Out of Track Sceadu's

First, I have talked to the two guys in question, and both were running the same style of blade. I will not say what brand, but you can ask them. Other reports from across the country have the same problem with this type of blade on other machines, both .60 and smaller and has been fixed once the blades were changed to another MFG. We have flown V-Blades and Hirobo OEM blades with good results and no flutter probs. The other gentlemen also had not either installed the included metal collective servo plates or installed them as instructed after speaking with them. This does make a difference. It is probably been nothing more than a simple oversight. I am waiting to hear back from them. Both are changing their blades and installing the plates as recommended by Hirobo. I hope to hear from them soon, either in this forum or by phone.

So Greg, thanks for the poll, and if you guys have any problems, please call me or email me at jeffg@modelrectifier.com so I can help you.


Thanks
Jeff Green "ampex456"
MRC/Altech/Hirobo/OK/ Enya
11-28-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

You da man!

Jeff Glad to hear you are addressing these issues. I'm sure as more Sceadu's sell that we shall hear the true stories.

Now I really want to know what blades are the problem childeren.

Greg you on the Hirobo payroll?

Ken B
11-28-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
beedub
Senior Heliman
Location: Arlington, Tx

You da Man!

Jeff, you are the da man! I replied to the other post while you were typing this responce. I am wondering if the blades I mentioned were the ones you incountered.

Again thanks for showing your concern!!
11-28-2001 Over year old.
 
 
ampex456
Senior Heliman
Location: Bayville, NJ

Hey Beedub,

I do not want to smear another MFG on the web as I do not have all the answers, I hope you understand that. I am sure if the other guys wish to post it, it should come from them. Hirobo has told me, they found that certain types of blades will flutter especially if the servo plates are not used.

Thanks

Jeff
11-28-2001 Over year old.
 
 
beedub
Senior Heliman
Location: Arlington, Tx

Totally understandable!

I also use the blades that I mentioned and never have had any issues with them.

You are showing what a class act you are. Thanks again!
11-28-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Greg Takacs
Veteran
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Jeff,
great to hear your position on the issue (whether there is an issue or not, is yet to be determined ). It is the absolute proper way of handling such a thing!!! Kudos!

I'm flying 600mm MS 3D blades and no blade flutter, so I guess we can take that one out of the equation . The stock 570's didn't flutter either. I DO have the servo plate upgrades installed!
11-28-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Augusto
rrAdvertiser
Location: San Diego, CA

I have mine with 600 mm V-Blades and I never had a problem.

If in fact the flutter happens only with a certain kind of blades then the fact that some brand of blades flutter doesn't necesarily mean that either the blades or the heli are poorly designed. It only means that the combination of the two produces a mechanically resonant combination that matches the flutter vibration. In other words, the same heli with a different set of blades should not flutter and the fluttering blades in a different heli shouldn't flutter either.

We will see what happens during the weekend. They are trying the same helis with V-Blades. Hopefully as Jeff predicts no fluttering

I still have the suspicion that the problem is not with a defect on the heli's design, brand of blades or the collective servo. I have this theory of mine of what might be the problem but I need to inspect those helis during the weekend to get more info.

Avant Aurora Ultimate
11-28-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Augusto
rrAdvertiser
Location: San Diego, CA

Today Richard flew his Sceadu with the MS 600 and it had the fluttering. Then he switched to the V-Blades 600 and flew the hell out of it with no more fluttering problems whatsoever.

Avant Aurora Ultimate
12-01-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Greg Takacs
Veteran
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Mine with the MS600mm 3D does not have the blade flutter...... Go figure.......
12-01-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
photomic
Heliman
Location: Singapore
Hi, I've just purchased a new Sceadu 30 and am wondering why the metal collective servo plates are required? How do they fix/influence the rotor blades? Just curious since I'm new to this hobby...

Thanks,

Ernest
12-04-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Pitch plates

The pitch plates tighten up the collective servo. Using the standard mounting method has caused some osolations in the collective system. These plates are an easy cheap way of helping fix it.

Ken B
12-04-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
helimodels
Senior Heliman
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Quote 
If in fact the flutter happens only with a certain kind of blades then the fact that some brand of blades flutter doesn't necesarily mean that either the blades or the heli are poorly designed. It only means that the combination of the two produces a mechanically resonant combination that matches the flutter vibration. In other words, the same heli with a different set of blades should not flutter and the fluttering blades in a different heli shouldn't flutter either.
In view on this perhaps you would name the offending combo. I think that's a fairer way of looking at the matter. Please give us a chance of avoiding problems. I mean, if I put NHP razor blades and an 8411 in my 30 and there is a resonance, I may in fact find out too late, when one component or another fails with consequences.
12-04-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Augusto
rrAdvertiser
Location: San Diego, CA

helimodels,

In the previous post:

Quote 
Originally posted by ColeopTer
Today Richard flew his Sceadu with the MS 600 and it had the fluttering. Then he switched to the V-Blades 600 and flew the hell out of it with no more fluttering problems whatsoever.



I posted the combination. Model Sport 600 with the Sceadu 50 seems to be the problem. Two people tried it and in both cases it had fluttering.

Avant Aurora Ultimate
12-04-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Greg Takacs
Veteran
Location: Fort Worth, TX

I must be a lucky one, MS works for me!
12-04-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
richardf
Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA Posts: Billions and Billions

The right combo

It almost looks like this thread has run it's course, I do want to say in my case the replacement of the MS blades with V-blades cured my problem. I'll be getting the measurements posted this weekend on the blades to help in understanding the problem, maybe it's just the CG, I don't know yet. Greg, I'm glad you don't have any flutter with your set of MS blades, want to trade! I was tached many times and the head speed didn't seem to make a difference. When I was first flying the Sceadu with the Enya-50 and the FRP Hirobo 570 blades, it was smooth as silk, never did it flutter. When I put my EX head on it, there wasn't flutter even with the MS blades, but that doesn't surprise me.

Richard.
12-05-2001 Over year old.
 
 
CRAZYJAS
Heliman
Location: Houston, Texas

Blade Flutter

Thought I would pass along my experience with my Sceadu 50 and blade flutter.

I have a set of Model Sport carbon 600mm blades that fluttered almost randomly in hover until I figured out that they would generally only flutter under near neutral pitch in a hover(i.e. trimmed the heli in a hover, then I would ever so slightly decrease pitch and presto=blade flutter!

Several weeks back at the Heli Fall Fest fun fly(Sulphur,LA), I had a conversation with the local Hirobo rep.(Texas) and he said he had the same exact setup with the same problem. We mentioned the situation to Ron L. and the Model Sport rep/dist. They were a little skeptical of our theory so Ron took his Sceadu 50 with ms 600s and was able to reproduce the worst flutter I've seen! We then tried some 620mm NHP blades(max length w/Sceadu 50) and could not produce any blade flutter! We then put the NHPs,Hirobo 570s, ms 600s,(and I think one other blade mfr) all on the same bolt for comparison and the MS 600mm blades kicked by at least 3-4mm=meaning that the positioning of the blade weight was aft of center, thus pushing the leading edge out in front of all the other blades in comparison. IMO, that is why the is a flutter issue.(even more pronounced sine the blade grips is trailing)

This does mot mean that the blades are defective,but that this type of blade config. does not suit all head combinations(i.e. the same blades seemed to work fine on my Raptor 50 with a only a flight or two)

I currently fly the stock Hirobo glass 570 blades because it is alot more fun or nimble, IMO than a good set of 600mm. Not that the 600s aren't good(o.s. 50 loves em), they are much more stable and great for autos, but they tend to create bigger loops and rolls etc.! Eitherway, I love my Sceadu 50- - much better than my Raptor. Makes me want a Freya!

Just thought I would share my experience- Great site - Great info -
THANKS GUYS

CRAZYJAS
Sceadu 50/Raptor 30/8U
12-05-2001 Over year old.
 
 
photomic
Heliman
Location: Singapore

83+ in.oz torque servo?

Hi Volkul, thanks for the explanation on the metal plates ... though this is the first time I've heard of servos needing such plates ... but then, I;'m new at this.

To all,
I've just looked at the addendum sheet and it recommends that a 6.0Kg/cm torque servo be used for pitch. This translates to 83+ oz/in torque correct? Going by the Futaba servo chart, I'd need at least S9303 coreless bb (99oz/in) ??? for a 30 size heli???

Somebody wake me up and tell me this is not so? Surely I made a mistake somewhere?



Thanks,

Ernest
12-05-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Greg Takacs
Veteran
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Photomic,

As far as the metal servo support plates go, they have been used on the Raptor 60 ever since they came out so the idea is not all that new.

Concerning the collective servo, I've read the same thing, 6kg/cm is in fact 83oz/in torque. Note that I have a Sceadu 50, but it comes with the same manual as the 30.
On mine I put in my JR531 BB sport servo at first and sure enough the collective felt rubbery, it was not realy pushing on the collective all that much and it had a hard time stopping a descent. The collective was way lagging behind the throttle, the heli would not climb out but overspeed the head instead.
So I popped in a JR8411 with 154oz of torque and it handles great. I liked it so much I put two more in the cyclic as well.
So as far as I'm concerned Hirobo probably wasn't lying in the manual when they've asked for a torquier servo.
12-05-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ampex456
Senior Heliman
Location: Bayville, NJ

Hi all,
I have used the 4131 servo from JR and the 9204 from Futaba with good results. I even tried a 148 for giggles. Broke it in a unexpected flame out at low level inverted. Just make sure you don't go too far out on the servo horn to get the pitch range you are looking for. All of mine are set at the 11.5 to 12mm settings. If you are going to hard 3D the machine, it is a good idea to use the strongest collective servo you can afford. Servos are the link between you and the heli. The better the servo, the better the feel.

Jeff g
12-05-2001 Over year old.
 
 
photomic
Heliman
Location: Singapore

Hi Greg & Jeff,

Thanks for the info on your setup and reasons for doing so. Looks like I'll be picking up 3 Futaba s9303 servos soon. Am not planning on any intentional hard 3D soon but since I'm a beginner, there could be the unintentional ones.

Hi Ken @ Volkul,

Noticed from your web site that you're using Futaba s9202 servos for your Sceadus. Any wish for more torque when using these servos?

Since the price diff between the s9202 and s9303 for 3 servos is only about USD$40 where I live, this is more to satisfy my curiosity than anything else.

Thanks all for the help and your informative web sites!



Thanks,

Ernest
12-06-2001 Over year old.
 
 
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