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Fast Lad Performance . Ace Hobby . Esprit Model

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e-Miniature Aircraft Furion - Razor - Ion-X > Charger the 8000 mah batteries ?
 
 
alexhbat
Heliman
Location: Paris

I fly with a IonX and 8000 mah packs, I charge them one by one, and it takes 2H30mn on the field.
My charger is a chameleon 636e from Schulze which could charge 11 lipo elements, so the two packs together.
I would like to know if it would be a real problem if I charged the batteries together,and if it would, why ?
I discharge them together, so, why couldn’t they be charged together ?
I haven’t done it so far, because they advise to charge them separately in the documentation.????


Alex

http://www.alexh.fr.st
06-28-2004 Over year old.
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gpyros
Key Veteran
Location: Palm Desert, California

Alex:

I always charge and discharge my 10s4p packs together using the Shulze 636 for charging.

Never a problem, and a lot faster!

Greg
06-28-2004 Over year old.
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alexhbat
Heliman
Location: Paris

Thanks a lot for answering. So , I'm going to test it this weekend...

Alex

http://www.alexh.fr.st
06-29-2004 Over year old.
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East Coast Tanics
Senior Heliman
Location: SOUTH DAYTONA FLORIDA

why would you want to discharge lithium cells?? you take a chance of hurting the packs.. Also it is not recommended to charge them in series as it can unbalance the packs!!! if you are using 8000mah packs then you shoudl get another charger !!
Robert
07-10-2004 Over year old.
 
 
gpyros
Key Veteran
Location: Palm Desert, California

Boomstrike:

Relax, dude, I discharge them by running in a heli... But if you think about it, there is nothing wrong with discharging them, it is a lot easier on them than the fast discharge while in use! It just doesn't do you any good unless you want to get the voltages identical.

My cells specifically say on them to charge as a 10 cell pack - all my cells were matched prior to assembling into packs.

Greg
07-10-2004 Over year old.
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rscamp
Veteran
Location: Ontario, Canada

A word of caution. As Robert says, most of the time, the cells in one pack are not well enough matched to the cells in another pack to use them continuously in series. It is best to balance them frequently by charging them separately.

There is no benefit to discharging LiPos unless it is to prepare them for longer term storage. Even then, only discharge to about 50% and keep 'em cool.

Rob
07-10-2004 Over year old.
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East Coast Tanics
Senior Heliman
Location: SOUTH DAYTONA FLORIDA

GPYRO
sorry to break the news to you but if you are goin to put youre lithiums up for storage you should fully charge them then let them sit in parrellel together!!!
Uguys can do what you want but i have been running lithiums for alittle over a year and i have had zero pack failures!! they alwasy sit fully charged!!! i never discharge them!!! that is a bigNO NO becuase if you go below 3.7 per celll you can screw the pack!!!!
just trying to give some good input here!!
Robert
07-10-2004 Over year old.
 
 
rscamp
Veteran
Location: Ontario, Canada

Robert.

If two LiPo battery packs are balanced to start with and they are of the same age, type and size, connecting them in parallel will help keep them balanced. However...

You won't see outright failures due to sub-optimal storage that early (within a year). On average, all you will see are slightly greater than necessary reductions in capacity.

Check the technical literature. Storage at 100% SOC is not recommended. This reduces cycle life. Manufacturers of battery maintenance ICs for portable electronics know this and design their components accordingly. This is why the batteries in your notebook computer slowly drop from 100% SOC after they are charged. The charging circuit DOES NOT try to keep it at 100% all the time even if it is plugged in. On a related note, the increased temperature inside your notebook is a major reason why the lithium chemistry batteries generally don't last very long. Granted, for our hobby use which is quite severe, storing at 100% is not a serious problem, but it does reduce capacity more quickly.

Another disadvantage of storing at 100% SOC is it will increase the speed at which individual cells within the pack become unbalanced.

LiPos deteriorate significantly with age even if unused. Storage at cooler emperatures prolongs life. The absolute best thing you can do to store LiPos for an extended period is to put them in a state of charge (SOC) of about 40% and keep them very cool, say near 0 deg. C. This will greatly increase the time it takes for them to get to the point that they can only deliver 80% or their original capacity, which is generally considered their useful life.

Rob
07-10-2004 Over year old.
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East Coast Tanics
Senior Heliman
Location: SOUTH DAYTONA FLORIDA

AS i said in my last post do what you want!! i have had O failure here!!
07-10-2004 Over year old.
 
 
East Coast Tanics
Senior Heliman
Location: SOUTH DAYTONA FLORIDA

Imight add i own over 2000 dollars worth of lithium packs!!!! to fly my ECONVERSIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!
07-10-2004 Over year old.
 
 
Peter65
Key Veteran
Location: Roxby Downs, South Australia.

While you guys are arguing over the do's and don'ts can you please give me a little input?

I am looking at converting my R60 to E R 60.

I have at my disposal

Hacker B50 XL15
2 x thunder power 3s4p 8000mAh
Hacker opto 77

Will this run my R60 and if so what sort of flight times?

thanks

Laughing at yourself will lengthen your life. Laughing at me will shorten it...
07-10-2004 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
East Coast Tanics
Senior Heliman
Location: SOUTH DAYTONA FLORIDA

HAHA
pete it will run youre R50 but not a 60!!With garys new box it will run a R60 on 10s 3p
Rcscamp
if you are looking for up to 6 month storage or more you would be @ 50% 3.8 per cell to be exact
iam talking about week to week or month to month
Robert
07-10-2004 Over year old.
 
 
Peter65
Key Veteran
Location: Roxby Downs, South Australia.

Damn... I guess I could just do the R30 then. Not so much fun for the $$ though

Laughing at yourself will lengthen your life. Laughing at me will shorten it...
07-10-2004 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
gpyros
Key Veteran
Location: Palm Desert, California

Boomstrike:

Who the heck ever said that I wanted to put them into storage? I fly them almost every day.

I disagree with your storage methods anyway, they should be stored at half charge if you want to give them a rest for a while.

Also, it is 3 volts per cell that is the minimum charge, not 3.7.

Shows that no matter how long you are doing something and how much money you have invested in them you can still make mistakes!

Greg
07-10-2004 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
East Coast Tanics
Senior Heliman
Location: SOUTH DAYTONA FLORIDA

haha
I HAVE HAD 0 CELL FAILURE SO I GUESS I WIL KEEP UP MY MISTAKES!!!!
07-10-2004 Over year old.
 
 
gpyros
Key Veteran
Location: Palm Desert, California

What a coincidence, neither have I!

I'll just keep on following the manufacturer's instructions for all my 10s4p packs on my big helis, as well as the smaller ones. Please feel free to do yours however you wish!

I'm sincerely glad yours have lasted as long as they have.

Greg

Maxi-Joker helicam
Joker-CX helicam
Graupner Jet Ranger (elec)
Raptor-50
Logo-10
9CH
07-10-2004 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
JettaTDI2001
Heliman
Location: earth

Also, it is 3 volts per cell that is the minimum charge, not 3.7.

Is this Quote incorrect??

3 volt min discharge!!!! per cell
07-10-2004 Over year old.
 
 
East Coast Tanics
Senior Heliman
Location: SOUTH DAYTONA FLORIDA

THIS IS A NO BRAINER
think about this if you were to store them @3volts in 6 months the cells will loose 10% were is that goin to put the voltage???? this a no brainer!!!!
PETER if you need any help on youre RAPPE conversion feel free to email me!!! or pm me!!
ALEXHBAT youre best solutiong is to buy another charger and use a charger per pack!!!!
iamm out later
07-11-2004 Over year old.
 
 
KillerBob
Heliman
Location: Denmark

Stop guessing

Read this instead

http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm

/Lars
07-11-2004 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
KillerBob
Heliman
Location: Denmark

Tony .. No fusss

The article just documents that from the moment LiPo's are produced the process of detoriation begins - and this process takes longer with lower charge rates than with high charge rates and the process takes longer in colder enviroments than it takes in hotter enviroments..End of story..

If you plan to spend 300 cycles in 3 months - this may not be imortant at all - but if you fly 100 cycles a year it may be good to know that it is better to charge just before you go fly instead of charging just after you fly.

It may allso be good to know for some that it is better to store the model/cells in a cool place than in a warm place. Even pilots that fly a lot, flys only a small percentage of the time available a day - so even if you go fly everyday it may be good to know that your LiPo's will last longer if you put them with the six-packs between flights than if you let them stay in the hot car...

This is the facts - all are free to decide what to do with it

/Lars
07-11-2004 Over year old.
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Thunder Power RC . Real Raptors . Mikado Modellhubschrauber

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e-Miniature Aircraft Furion - Razor - Ion-X > Charger the 8000 mah batteries ?
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